As we head into the next presidential election you'll notice that the pitch, the pause, the rise and fall of a leader’s voice captures hearts and minds just as effectively—if not more so—than the words themselves.
As I’ve noted before, “The way you sound has a profound impact on how your message is received, often more so than the content of the message itself.”Do You Sound Like a Leader? explores this in greater detail.
As we look at the vocal delivery styles of 2024 presidential candidates Donald Trump and Kamala Harris, we find that the way a leader speaks can profoundly shape public perception. For leaders, experts, and entrepreneurs, understanding this dynamic can be the key to leading effectively and making your voice heard.
The Science of Persuasion: Why Vocal Qualities Matter
Sure, content is king. But the crown jewels? They’re all in the delivery. Robert Cialdini, the godfather of influence psychology, points out that authority and likability are key factors in persuasion—and these often hinge on how a message is delivered. As Cialdini explains, “We are more likely to be influenced by people who are authoritative, who appear credible and knowledgeable, regardless of the content of their message.” A deep, resonant voice doesn’t just sound good; it signals authority, commanding respect and attention before a leader even gets to the meat of their message.
Lee Hartley Carter, a renowned strategist and author of Persuasion: Convincing Others When Facts Don’t Seem to Matter, has spent years advising Fortune 500 companies and political campaigns on the art of effective communication. Her work highlights the critical role that emotional resonance and authenticity play in leadership. According to Carter, a voice that truly connects with listeners can make all the difference in persuasion. And let’s be honest, we’ve all been in meetings where the speaker’s monotone droning put us on a one-way trip to Snoozeville. But with the right vocal techniques, you can keep your audience engaged and attentive.
When a leader modulates their voice—using strategic pauses, varying their pitch, and adjusting their pacing—they’re not just holding attention; they’re shaping perceptions. A well-timed pause can create anticipation and emphasize a point, while variations in tone can keep the audience emotionally connected. Sometimes, how you say something lands more impactfully than what you say.
With these foundational ideas in mind, let’s explore how current leaders like Donald Trump and Kamala Harris use their vocal delivery to influence public perception.
Trump vs. Harris: A Vocal Showdown
The 2024 presidential race isn’t just a clash of ideologies—it’s a vocal duel. Donald Trump continues to wield his voice like a weapon, with his recent speech at the 2024 CPAC showcasing his signature assertive tone. As he declared, “We will take back the White House,” his booming voice was designed to project strength and determination to his base. It’s no wonder Trump’s rallies and speeches still feel like rock concerts—he’s mastered the art of keeping the audience on their feet, even if it’s with the same chorus repeated a dozen times. But as The Washington Post pointed out in 2019, while Trump’s “booming and relentless” tone solidifies his image as a strong leader, it’s also divisive. To some, his aggressive style comes off as bullying, deepening the divide between his supporters and detractors.
On the other side of the vocal spectrum is Kamala Harris. Her speech on gun violence prevention in June 2023 is a prime example of her calm, deliberate, and empathetic tone. Harris’s voice flowed with measured cadence, her empathetic tone wrapping around each word like a warm embrace—inviting listeners in rather than overwhelming them. During this speech, her deliberate pauses and slower pace were used to emphasize the gravity of the topic, resonating deeply with her audience. However, Harris faces a different set of challenges—particularly gender biases. As The New York Times explored in 2023, Harris’s vocal delivery is often judged against traditional gender expectations. Some praise her composed demeanor, while others criticize her for lacking the forcefulness they expect from a leader—especially when compared to male counterparts like Trump. This bias reflects broader societal expectations, where women leaders are often caught in a double bind: be too soft, and you’re weak; too strong, and you’re shrill.
Critical Thinking: Separating Content from Delivery
So, how can you navigate the nuances of vocal delivery without getting swayed by style over substance? Here are some tips:
Focus on the Content: Pay close attention to the actual message. Is the candidate backing up their claims with facts? Are they providing clear, logical arguments, or are they relying on emotional appeals and repetition to fill the gaps?
Beware of Emotional Manipulation: Notice when a speaker uses tone and inflection to play on your emotions. While emotions are a powerful communication tool, they shouldn’t replace rational analysis. As Lee Hartley Carter notes, “The leaders who resonate most emotionally with their audience are those who can authentically project the emotions that match their message. It’s not just what they say, but how they make people feel.” Ask yourself if the emotional tone aligns with the facts presented. How to Free Yourself from Emotional Velcro and Create Psychological Safety in the Workplace offers insights on managing emotional responses effectively.
Consider the Whole Picture: Vocal qualities can enhance or distort a candidate’s perceived credibility. Look beyond the delivery to assess their track record, policies, and actions.
Check Your Biases: Be mindful of unconscious biases that might affect how you perceive a candidate’s voice. Gender, race, and other factors can shape our perceptions of leadership qualities in ways we might not even realize.
Diversify Your Sources: Engage with a range of news outlets and analyses to get a balanced view. Different perspectives can help you see beyond any single source’s bias and get a fuller picture of the candidate’s platform and delivery.
Next time you hear a political speech, ask yourself: Are you being swayed by the logic of the argument, or is the speaker’s tone doing most of the work? How does the delivery shape your perception? By sharpening these critical thinking skills, you can better discern the substance behind a candidate’s words, making informed choices that go beyond surface-level impressions.
Summary and Takeaways
In leadership, how you say something can be as important—if not more so—than what you say. As we’ve seen with Donald Trump and Kamala Harris, vocal qualities significantly influence public perception, with societal biases adding another layer of complexity, particularly regarding gender. But by honing critical thinking skills and staying mindful of the difference between content and delivery, we can navigate these complexities and make more informed decisions. As the 2024 election approaches, let’s listen not just to the words our leaders speak, but to how they speak them. After all, it’s not just about sounding persuasive—it’s about leading with integrity. For more on this, see Strengthening Your Voice of Leadership in Uncertain Times.
And as we continue to explore the power of voice, whether in leadership or in technology like AI audiobooks, it’s clear that how we communicate can make all the difference.
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
Connecting With People Through the Power of Audiobooks
How are you getting your audience’s attention?
As you know, content is everywhere and the demands for attention are higher every day.
It’s easy for even the most compelling messages to get lost in the noise.
It’s critical to cut through the clutter and truly connect with your audience on a deeper, more personal level.
This is where the benefits of audiobooks now truly shine…
Audiobooks aren’t just a “format;” they’re an intimate experience that brings your words to life. When your voice tells your story, it’s not just heard—it’s felt. The cadence, the emotion, the subtle inflections—they all add layers of meaning that deepen the connection between you and your listener.
It’s an opportunity for deeper connection through content than nearly any other type of content that you will invest your time in creating.
Your message is more than just words on a page; it’s a reflection of your passion, your expertise, and your vision. When you translate that into an audiobook, you’re not just sharing information—you’re forging a connection.
So why aren’t more people producing audiobooks?
There are a few common issues and misconceptions we hear when talking with authors, publishers, editors and book coaches.
Misconception 1: Audiobooks Won’t Reach My Audience
Many authors underestimate the reach and influence of audiobooks. They think that their audience prefers physical books or eBooks and that producing an audiobook won’t add much value. But the truth is, audiobooks have steadily grown in popularity over the years.
52% of all U.S. adults have listened to an audiobook in their lifetime, and in 2023, revenue increased by 9% to $2 billion, according to the Audio Publishers Association.
Moreover, audiobooks can expand your reach to people with disabilities or those who prefer auditory learning. For many, reading can be a challenge due to visual impairments or dyslexia. Audiobooks offer an inclusive way for these individuals to enjoy your work without barriers.
By not offering an audiobook, you could be missing out on connecting with a whole segment of your audience who prefers consuming content in this format.
Misconception 2: Audiobooks Now Aren’t a Good Investment
Another common misconception is that producing audiobooks now requires a costly investment with little return. However, this couldn’t be further from the truth. Audiobooks can dramatically increase your audience, influence, and income. An audiobook has the potential to generate revenue indefinitely. Plus, with platforms like Audible, Google Play, Apple Books, and even Spotify, it’s easier than ever to distribute your audiobook to a global audience.
Authors are often surprised to learn that they don’t have to give away their royalties or go through a complicated process to see a return on their investment. The key is to work with an experienced team that understands how to navigate the audiobook market effectively.
Misconception 3: Audiobook Production is Complicated and Time-Consuming
Perhaps the most common reason authors hesitate to create an audiobook is the belief that it’s a complicated, time-consuming process. Many authors don’t know where to start or feel overwhelmed by the technical aspects of audiobook production. This is where working with a partner like Twin Flames Studios can make all the difference. We handle everything—from recording and editing to distribution—so you can focus on what you do best: telling your story. Our streamlined process ensures that your audiobook is produced to the highest quality standards while allowing you to maintain full creative control.
Let’s Create Audio Magic Together
The world of audiobooks is rich with opportunity, and there’s never been a better time to explore it.
Ready to take the next step?
I’m hosting an in-depth webinar on September 19th, 2024 at 12 PM Eastern that will show you how to boost your bottom line, expand your audience, and create an audiobook that will give you content for years to come. This is where you start.
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
If you're like most thought leaders, you've spent time developing a course or program that you were beyond excited to share with the world. It checked all the boxes:
It answered every question your ideal client might have.
It solved a frustration or pain point your ideal client shared with you.
It aligned with your brand's core mission and values.
And you were SURE it would sell out in minutes.
…but when you announced your shiny new program or product…instead of sales, you heard the sound of crickets. OUCH. We have ALL been there.
Now, part of owning a business is taking risks. And while you can't eliminate every chance of disappointment that comes with running your business, you can lessen the risk of selling a whopping zero programs or products with a very simple (yet often ignored) tactic: testing your messaging.
Instead of spending too much time thinking about creating a new offer or program…
Or spending months (or years) developing an entire suite of programs and offers…
…today, we are excited to share our tried-and-true method that will allow you to assess whether your idea is perceived as genuinely transformative to your audience – instead of just assuming that it will be.
Growing an aligned audience excited to learn from you requires cultivating a community eager to receive your wisdom, support, and guidance.
If you want to cultivate an aligned audience of humans who are excited about you and your business, you need to take a hard look at three key things:
Your niche
Your voice
The Invitation
Once you master those three things, you'll find that selling your programs and products becomes more straightforward and practically effortless.
Know Your Niche
It's not enough to assume that you're “niched down” – you've got to go deep here because surface-level “knowing” is no longer enough.
While you can narrow your niche in many ways, you want to focus on the ways that will result in them being able to say, “OH, THAT IS ME,” followed by, “I BELONG HERE.”
And, no, targeting people based on their Netflix obsession or their passion for crocheting isn't going to work. You'll waste precious time focusing on these things.
Instead, please focus on the actions they would be taking before working with you.
Use Your Voice
Please note that this does not refer to your volume–and this is where using your Content Personality® makes a massive difference in the energy of how your message is received.
The internet is a loud place – and that's before we even take a peek at social media.
When we talk about using your voice, we're talking about communicating your mission-driven message using your Content Personality® so that your narrowed niche can hear you, get excited, and get on board with your solutions, values, and more.
That is how aligned community growth happens!
Invite Them to Join Your Community
You may have already discovered this, but it's not enough to “post and pray,” hoping your aligned audience will find you as if by magic.
Instead of just hoping, be tactical with your messaging – invite your audience to share your vision for a changed world. This type of “leaning in” allows others to see you as human and amplifies the need to spread your message.
Suppose you're determined to create a lasting impact on your business and spread your mission. In that case, you'll need to become highly committed to being visible (using your Content Personality®), so your aligned audience can get to know you and cultivate a relationship with you.
Growing an aligned audience is possible, but it takes time, dedication, and courage!
When you share your mission and services with your audience in a way that is genuinely aligned with all the parts that make you UNIQUE, you'll earn their trust and create invaluable relationships (which will make offering your fantastic, ground-breaking, life-changing programs and products much easier).
The thing about growing an engaged, aligned audience is that everyone you're connected to absorbs and processes your messaging at their own pace.
This naturally means that some of your audience isn't ready to buy…yet. As a business owner, it's important to realize (and accept) that if someone doesn't invest with you today, that does not mean they won't be ready to invest with you later (maybe tomorrow or next week!).
Don't assume that someone not clicking the “buy” button means they don't want to work with you – they may need to grow your relationship first.
But wouldn't it be nice to know if, next time, introducing your brilliant idea makes sense for where the majority of your audience is right now?
(Yes, yes, it would.)
Take Action
If you're ready to make an impact and share your vision for change, take some time to review those three key things that can make or break your next offer.
Ask yourself:
Your Niche: Am I niched down enough? Is the audience I'm speaking to engaging and interacting with me?
Your Voice: Am I communicating effectively so that the people who read or listen to or watch my messaging understand my point of view, values, and mission?
The Invitation: Have you given the humans who follow your content time to get to know you and grow into a trusting relationship that will naturally lead to them investing in your program or product?
If you don't score perfectly across the board, that's normal (and expected). Review some of your more popular posts, videos, or emails and note how you highlighted your niche, used your voice, and invited your audience to take action.
If you don't have any posts that seem popular, take a broad overview of your messaging and identify areas where you need to improve for clarity and understanding. A great place to start is by learning your natural Content Personality®, and lucky for you, we've created a simple, 3-minute (seriously) quiz to help you understand precisely what your Content Personality® is and how to best utilize your natural talents in your messaging.
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
More About M. Shannon Hernandez
M. Shannon Hernandez is ALL ABOUT THAT JOY in life and biz. She is specifically known around the globe for The Content Personality® Wheel and is the Founder of Joyful Business Revolution™, a business growth strategy and consultancy company that works with coaches, consultants, and service-based business owners. Shannon and her team specialize in organic mission-driven marketing and creative campaigns that help their clients grow aligned audiences and deepen community relationships, so they grow their business for GOOD, resulting in more joy, more time-off, and more profits with purpose.
Did you know one of the most powerful ways you can connect with your clients is through podcasting? You can learn more about the benefits of podcasting, what questions you need to answer before you begin your podcast, and how Twin Flames Studios helps get your voice into more ears on my guest interview with Bruce Eckfeldt on the Scaling Up Services podcast.(Scaling Up Services Podcast with Bruce Eckfeldt, October 2021)
Tina spoke with Bruce Eckfeldt on the Scaling Up Services podcast to discuss how podcasts hone your brand, provide evergreen marketing content, and create deeper relationships.
In this episode, you'll learn:
Why audio is one of the most intimate mediums for storytelling
The top questions to ask before you start your podcast
How podcasts can revitalize your marketing and expand your reach
Bruce Eckfeldt Are you a CEO looking to scale your company faster and easier? Check out Thrive Roundtable. Thrive combines a moderated peer group mastermind expert one on one coaching access to proven growth tools and a 24/7 support community. Created by Inc. award-winning CEO and certified Scaling Up Business coach, Bruce Eckfeldt, Thrive will help you grow your business more quickly and with less drama. For details on the program, visit eckfeldt.com/thrive.
Welcome, everyone. This is Scaling Up Services. I'm Bruce Eckfeldt. I'm your host. Our guest today isTina Dietz. She is the founder at Twin Flames Studios. We're going to talk to her about the work that she does with companies helping them with creating content, with promotion. This is a really kind of interesting topic. I think so many service companies based their marketing, based their sales and lead development, based on thought leadership and getting content out in the world. And there's so many different types of content and so many different ways you can do it. I really think they–obviously I love podcasting–but you know, podcasts, audiobooks, you know, spoken word kind of content, there's so many things you can do with it. There's so many things you can use to generate awareness, generate thought leadership, generate leads. I'm excited for this and excited to hear Tina’s story and how she got into this this world of audio content production and what she's been doing with service companies. So, with that, Tina, welcome to the program.
Tina DietzHey, Bruce, thanks for having me.
It's a pleasure having you on. So before we dive into what you're doing with Twin Flames right now and stuff, why don't we talk a little bit about you and get a sense of your background? Give us the story. What was your professional journey? And how did you get into what you're doing today?
Well, like most entrepreneurs, it's fairly stupid. It's just like, “Well, how the hell did this happen?” Yeah, yeah. And that's, and that's what we hear more than everything. If you had asked me, you know, when I was growing up, if, you know, in 25 years or whatever, you're going to own a company that produces audio content in the land of thought leadership for service-based companies. I'm sorry, what? What, what? It didn't even exist, right? You know, at the time?
So my upbringing was I had a younger sibling–that was a business. My parents owned a business that they started when I was three years old. It was my younger sibling, and I hated it. It was a wood burning stove and fireplace business. So real sexy, awesome. And basically, that was my constant companion growing up. So I was steeped like a tea bag in entrepreneurship. From a very young age, I started answering phones when I was four and going to trade shows when I was six, I do a whole talk will have to do another time maybe on how I found my purpose in life through the Ginsu knife demonstration at a local fair. So that’s a whole thing, that's the whole thing. And, you know, I never really thought I'd own a business, but I became a therapist–for a number of reasons. Childhood was not a great place. But you know, lessons learned. It's one of those things. And I've spent a lot of time in the world of personal development, in leadership and all of that. So cultivating myself, of course, created in me a desire to see what else could be done for other people.
That led me to coaching and consulting, which then ended up leading me to podcasting and ultimately to audio production. Basically, through a paid hobby I had as a voice actor. You know, I'm an entrepreneur, we can't have regular hobbies, we have to have hobbies that pay us. That's the way it works. We can't have normal hobbies. So I was a voice actor on the side and taking some classes and masterclasses in audiobook narration. And I had this chocolate and peanut butter moment, this light bulb, aha, that, “Oh, my God, why aren't all my clients and colleagues who are doing best selling campaigns and producing books, why aren't they doing audiobooks?” And that was, as Michael Gerber from The E Myth says, you know, my “entrepreneurial seizure” that led me to investigate the world of audio and led me to a big gap in the market and dove into that.
I took over my business within a year of starting to offer services in this big market gap of done-for-you audiobooks, and also the corporate side of podcasting. And that is kind of was the best decision that I ever made. And so I went from basically being a solopreneur, consultant who'd worked with more than 20 industries in eight countries to being the CEO of a company that now produces content in the land of audio that changes lives and hearts and minds for service-based companies and making sure that they're having this beautiful, human, authentic voice of their company that comes through this medium of audio.
Yeah, I'm curious. You've had a couple of different kind of pivots in your commercial world and career what are some of the things that you had to learn or had to kind of change about your thinking, your leadership, your approach during those pivots?
Bruce, I thought you said this was only a half hour podcast.
The top two. Just the top two.
The top two. One: choose who gets in your ear very carefully, very carefully. I'm very much of a happy puppy kind of person. I'm just like, “Yeah, let's do it. Let's change the world. Let's make it happen.” I have a lot of enthusiasm and energy and kind of that visionary habit–you see something and you want to make it happen. And it took me a long time to really learn how to vet the people that I was working with, or who I was throwing in with, because I assumed for a long time, in a very naive way, that everyone had the same values that I did around integrity and communication, and, you know, working together and making sure everybody wins. And it doesn't always work that day. Most people, most people, 99% of people on the planet are doing their best. But you know, problems and challenges that come up, don't always bring out the best in people. Sometimes it brings out the worst in people. And so learning how to create relationships over time and cultivate those relationships carefully has been a huge game changer in my world to keep things consistent and growing in the right direction.
And the other piece of the puzzle has been, you know, doing my own inner work. I'd say all the time that we were born with two voices: the voice you speak with and the voice that speaks to you. And working on the voice that speaks to me has made the biggest difference in anything that I've done as a leader, as a business owner, as a partner, a wife, a mom, you know, on any of that, to cultivate that inner world–and I could do many, many, many hours, and all the things that have happened there. But suffice to say it's been a journey.
That's a really great, that's a great realization. And yeah, I think it's, you know, time is your most precious commodity and where you spend it, you know, how you spend it, who you spend it with, are all kinds of things that are really going to influence your success and what you end up doing. Tell me a little bit about kind of why audio content? I mean, what's your kind of take on the world? You know, that we're in today? Why is audio content so powerful, so important? Why have you chosen to focus on it?
Well, going back to what I said a moment ago about our internet, our voices, it's something every human being on the planet is born with. And it's something that cannot be taken away. And speaking, as someone who has felt in the past that my voice was taken away and was suppressed, having that voice and having a place at the table to have that voice heard, is incredibly valuable. And so, everything that I have done, and what we do as a company with Twin Flames, is designed to give people a place at the table so that their voices are heard. And then it creates this incredible ripple effect that you know, podcasts and audiobooks are some of the lowest hanging fruit on the planet for people to start changing their lives.
If we can be a part of more leadership voices and more positive voices and more great information, reaching people all over the world, so that they can start to change their lives. That is a really powerful place to be. It is really about making the world a better place one kind of drip of audio at a time. And audio is very, very, very intimate compared to most other forms of media. It's single focus. Most people listen to audio right into their ear. So there is a neurological connection that's very powerful between, you know, the earbud I have in my ear, and the center of my brain, the amygdala, the hippocampus, all of those things. It's not just higher brain functions being impacted by the voice. And so there's an intimacy created in an impact that's really important. And storytelling, of course, is incredibly powerful worldwide. It's something that connects all of humanity. So when we bring all these factors together, neurological, you know, storytelling, how we're wired, the universal power of the human voice to create relationship–it's a very, very powerful medium. And it can be used in so many different ways and sliced and diced, and at the pace we're living at, you know, audio is the most portable form of media. You can listen when you can't read you can listen when you can't watch. So you know, it's never gone away. It's never going to go away. And all of those things together make it what I consider the perfect storm for perfect content.
Yeah, I was like that idea that audio content literally gets you in your prospect’s head.
Mm-hmm. Yeah, you got it.
So what are all the kinds of formats these days? I mean, we kind of went from you know, I date myself accidentally when I say I'm listening to a book on tape or something.
I know, right? Me too.
It's morphed so many times, like what is your kind of how do you kind of lay out the scope or the types of audio content that that you have at your disposal these days?
Well, we usually start with a primary form of content, which is generally a podcast. Podcasting, of course, is something that is hot right now. I’m on one as we speak, and it provides a nice bulk of content to start with, and a framework to start with. So unlike a video, the average video watcher will watch two minutes, but the average podcast listener will listen for 40 minutes.
And it's actually much harder to create short form content than it is slightly longer form content. We have thoughts, you know, curating what we say, you know, the brevity or like cutting things down to its core is much more challenging than this kind of a conversational format. And so, it allows people to be very natural, and very expansive in what they're talking about to dig into nitty gritty and to know that the listener is still going to be interested more than two minutes in, so you're not trying to pack things in. So we start with a longer form 20-30 minute podcast, usually sometimes longer, sometimes shorter, but that's on average what it is. And that gives us a lovely bulk of content to work with.
From there, there's all different ways to slice and dice that type of content, repurpose it, reuse it. And the authenticity that comes through when you're using audio and using this type of format is really important to reach people on a deeper basis, rather than just an informational basis.
Yeah. And when you look at companies, what are I guess, what are some of the companies or situations that are best served with audio content? Like who can really benefit from this form of content?
Well, we love working with relationship-focused, service-based companies. People who, when they're working with their clients, they have long-term relationships with their clients. For example, companies, which seem very dry, but there's a lot of content available in the financial world, in insurance, for example, education of varying kinds, and even things like retail, retail conglomerates, and things like that, that are creating more experiences. Travel can be served in this way, as well, although it does, definitely does need to be paired with the visual aspect as well. But it can be really, really, really beautiful. You will see a lot of influencer podcasting, that's generally not our super cup of tea.
We do a lot of work in the leadership space, though, helping to humanize brands that are large, and give the brand an avatar because we don't really do business with faceless, nameless corporations. We want to do business with people. So being able to communicate brand values and culture and leadership and innovation through the avatar of a podcast host is extremely powerful. Another industry that benefits a lot from podcasting is healthcare. And all of these have constraints with compliance and communication and legal and all of that. But we're able to navigate all of those waters, as well.
Yeah, yeah. So what are some of the other challenges? If you are interested in developing audio content? Like what do you need to kind of consider or think about setup?
The lift is largely at the beginning when you're–well with any type of content, right, so you have to decide that has enough value that you're going to spend the brain capacity and the bandwidth and the time to work with a company like ours, so that we can help you shape that voice and shape the type of content that's really going to benefit you. So choosing that it's going to be a priority.
And then having deep, intimate communication and regular awesome content are things that you really want to do, you also need to decide in terms of you know–and we work with our companies on this–like who's going to be hosting, who's your avatar, who's your people or person that you're going to be featuring. And there's a lot of creative ways to work with that scenario, as well. Everything from solo hosts to two hosts to a panel discussion and everything in between. There's, there's a lot of different ways to manage those kinds of questions, particularly if there's multiple people inside of a company who want to be at the forefront being that avatar for the company, that's all completely manageable.
Another thing the company really needs to decide is if their marketing department, and their team, how we're going to dovetail this with their other strategic initiatives. Podcasting should be one piece and audio should be a piece of a larger strategic picture for a company. It should never be a band-aid or just an outlier. It needs to be integrated because it is something that has high strategic value, and can augment or replace creating content in other areas like blog posts, social media post images, articles for industry publications, and even events and getting used in events in different ways. So, there's a lot of applications and being willing to dive into the strategy is super important.
And what goes into that strategy? What questions are you asking or what do companies need to think about, you know, in terms of understanding kind of the bigger picture strategy before they really get into, you know, executing a particular kind of audio content strategy?
Yeah, we like to get into working with their marketing team. and finding out what are their core values that they're looking to communicate. What is that mission? What is their vision for their company, and then building out kind of an avatar of their host, not of their audience, but of their host. You know, if you had to personify your company, who is kind of that person and that spokesperson to do that? That's certainly an area that we start with, we also need to look at, as I mentioned, their current strategic initiatives. What's already working for them in terms of their marketing? How can podcasting build upon that and make it even more robust? And what are their pain points that we can address that are challenging?
So one of the pain points we run into a lot with companies is just the generation of content to begin with, particularly from a very busy team. A larger company, you know, when you ask somebody to go and say, “Hey, would you write a blog post on this?” somebody who's a technician or a salesperson or whatever, they may not be a writer to do that. Using interview techniques, we can extract and pull really wonderful, real conversational information from team members that can be pulled into podcasting content, or then even turned into articles or ebooks or, you know, other types of content, as well. And the creation process becomes 100 times easier. And this is, of course, scalable for any size company to do that, whether we're working with a sales team, or we're working with, you know, a CPA firm.
Yeah. You mentioned a couple times the idea of leveraging the content, what are some ways that you can kind of use the, the initial content, leverage it in different ways? You know, repurpose it. What are some things that companies should be thinking about when they develop a kind of a content strategy, starting with audio content?
Sure, I'll kind of walk you through a whole process, potential process flow on that. So let's say your podcast gets made, and the audio content is going out to 20-30 different audio distribution platforms, everything from Spotify to Apple podcasts and whatnot. So it lives all out in the world of public podcasting. Well, then the full edited transcript of that podcast, along with an embedded player, which has a number of features on it that are really helpful for the listener, click to tweets, and custom captioned images are all embedded on the website, usually in the form of a blog post. So we have, first, fresh content that goes into your blog.
And secondly, this is all gorgeous for your search engine optimization. Google loves fresh, long form conversational content, because Google is moving towards AI for their search engine optimization. This longer form conversational podcast content is so helpful for SEO, particularly with all the bells and whistles to kind of go along with it. So, from there, you can take the we have always have a little summary at the top and we have our quotes that are pulled out. Those are repurposed into social media posts, usually either on say a company page on LinkedIn that are then shared with the employees, shared with the team so that then they all can share those posts as well.
We also pull out short clips, little highlights from the podcast and turn them into what are called audiograms, which are little shareable, closed-caption dynamic videos. Those are also shared on social media. And one of my other favorite places to use audiograms is to embed them in related blog posts on the site that aren't necessarily the podcast episode, but maybe related content. So then you are cross-pollinating your website content and also creating a more dynamic experience for somebody visiting your website, because now you've got this lovely little 30-second to one minute long video that's breaking up the content on a related post and maybe getting people interested in staying on your website longer. Yeah, so those are just a few of the things that you can do.
We even recommend that whoever is the guest on the podcast, or even the host, depending on the situation, repurpose the link to their podcast on the publication section of their LinkedIn profile. A lot of people only use articles or blog posts, but you can use your podcast interviews as part of your publications list. And that helps build out, of course, your LinkedIn presence. For those folks of us who are in the B2B world or in the, you know, the business world. It's really nice to have that additional fresh content on your LinkedIn profile to kind of keep you top of mind for people.
So those are just a couple. Those are just a couple elements. And the other big one we see a lot of is turning podcast content into industry publication articles. So basically having writers–either folks we've introduced you to, or folks on their team. One of our companies that we work with primary tax solutions, they're a specialty tax company, and they've now had six articles based on their podcasts–content produced and published in publications like Accounting Today.
Yeah, I love that idea is like you create one piece and then you can find lots of different ways. Oh, my goodness repurposing it makes it so much easier or just create so much more leverage in terms of the work you do. What are some of the challenges? Certainly, when I started podcasting, you know, it wasn't, there was some hesitation and trepidation about kind of really getting into this and putting myself out there like that. What do you do to help folks who, you know, are considering this, but they're not quite sure they have maybe some, you know, maybe a little bit of fear around some of this stuff. You know, creating this content, really putting it out there–what are ways in which you help them kind of evaluate and create an opportunity for them to really get into this space?
It really just, it lives in the world of conversation. So, Bruce, would it be accurate to say that, you know, one of your big considerations was time?
Oh, absolutely.
Yeah, yeah. And that's really the biggest thing we have to talk about is, where are your priorities, and where is your time going to be, because even if we're handling 90% of what has to go into the podcast production, we're still going to need, you know, some time for the marketing team and of course, the host and things like that to spend some time in that arena. So it just really has to be a priority, and they need to be well suited. So there's a lot of evaluation that goes on at the beginning, everything from talking about, like I said, the creation of kind of this avatar. We even use thought leadership archetypes that we have developed based on the 12 Jungian archetypes to help kind of shape the brand of the podcast in conjunction with the company's brand to make sure that there's this consistent voice.
So everything that we do really lives in relationship and inquiry and curiosity. And and then from there, the strategy, but we come at it–I would say that, you know, a lot of times I'm practicing my “Business Buddha” and that means I come from a place of non-attachment. It really has to be all about the clients and not about us and seeing what's going to be best. And sometimes it's not the best solution for that company, or it's not the right time. Sometimes it's the absolute perfect time, and the company is absolutely 100% ready to go. Sometimes there's a little bit of a delay until a few ducks get in a row and we say, “Hey, you know, you really should have X, Y, and Z handled before we start this process.” So it always has to be in the best interest of the company, so that we can get the best product, because, as you know, Bruce, podcasting isn't a one and done deal. It's a long tail game. Yeah, you know, so we got to have time.
Yeah, no, let's dig into that just a little bit. ‘Cause I find I see a lot of podcasts out there that get to like episode eight.
Yeah.
You know, big plans, big ideas, and then, you know, just, you know, a big initial push, but, they just kind of fade quickly. What are some things that can help you to prevent that or will help you, you know, kind of be in it for the long game?
Well, most of our companies, we recommend starting with a bi-weekly schedule, instead of a weekly schedule. You can always add episodes. You can always add frequency as you go. But bi-weekly gives enough frequency for folks to really get content out on a regular basis without it necessarily being an overwhelming time commitment. We also work to develop out the content calendar, and make sure that we've actually got, you know, 12 or 24 potential episodes kind of planned out. And then many times we're helping with, you know, getting the guests on. You know, let's look at your networking list. Who do you want to have on and how can we help you facilitate that communication, the guest preparation and making the actual recording process as easy as possible for folks? You know, you and I both use an interface that's very easy to get on. You're using was it Tricast here. Is that what we're both on?
Yeah.
So Tricast, Squadcast, Riverside FM–there's a bunch of them that really helped make the recording process very high quality and very easy, no matter who you are, where you are, as long as you've got a relatively decent internet connection. Yeah, and we help facilitate those with live direction, sometimes, helping people actually kind of feel comfortable, relax them. We do episode preparation sometimes and actually create the outlines for episodes for companies and working with their marketing team to make it easier for them to just have a nice flow of every episode. And of course, any kind of host or guest training when it comes down to the actual vocal or interview side of things. It's really a matter of finding out what are the needs, what are the desires, and creating the right solutions to fill it. There's no cookie cutter solution.
Yeah. And are most of your clients looking to develop leads for like a lead funnel or what are the outcomes that sort of the tangible business outcomes that you're typically focused on with clients?
The tangible outcomes that clients are usually looking to focus on are multifold. Podcasting of this particular kind is a beautiful combination of relationship marketing, influence marketing, and content marketing. So we're looking to have guests chosen strategically that are not necessarily leads for their company–there's a whole philosophy of podcasting that you interview people you want to have as clients. That's not really where we live. The companies that we work with are well-established. They're doing very, very well in their fields. And this is really a move from having a brand to becoming thought leaders in an industry. So it has more to do with influence and high quality content than it does with directly getting leads.
But that being said, it usually–well, actually, it always–it always ends up in developing leads, because collaborations come out of the guests that you have on the show, out of the visibility that you have, out of the elevation in the industry of now becoming a media presence, all of those things happen, and it is largely because podcasting opens doors when it comes to relationships. You know, our clients are always looking to have high quality guests on their show, and then following up with those guests afterwards to help deepen that relationship and develop collaboration inevitably adds leads to additional opportunities and more leads 100% of the time.
Yeah. And what recommendations do you have for folks in terms of kind of picking subjects, things that you're going to weave into your conversations, finding guests? I mean, how do you go from, “Hey, I want to start a podcast, I want to, you know, have these sort of business outcomes,” to actually getting things scheduled and figuring out what you're going to talk about?
Oh, okay, that's a big world. So let's break it down just into a couple of first steps. One is to look at your values. What do you want to be known for? You know, who are you in in the world? What does your company want to be known for? And what are your brand values, the pillars that you operate by that you want to make sure it get communicated out to an audience?
Then there's a little bit of a Venn diagram. You've got your brand values and your culture, and then you have what you're really good at, you know, what's your areas of focus, and you're going to overlap those two areas on each other. And then the third area that you're going to your trifecta, a little three circle Venn diagram is going to be how do you want to communicate it?
So when you're talking about podcasting, you have to have somebody on your team who's got a proclivity towards a microphone. In some way, shape or form, they have to have a desire for it. Because otherwise you're going to end up you know, like, like Ben Stein in Ferris Bueller's Day Off. “Bueller, Bueller? Bueller?” It's got to be dynamic, right? You somebody who is inclined. So that you know, so then you got your format of your show. So you've got those three pieces that you want overlap to find kind of your sweet spot in podcasting. And I will say, that's where you start. Podcasting is one of those things, just like I hate to say it, a website. That is, you're always evolving over time, and you're going to have seasons. You're going to have segments, you're going to evolve it over time. So you got to start with where you're most comfortable and most seasoned in your expertise, and then you're going to evolve and grow it from there.
Tina, this has been a pleasure if people want to find out more about you about the work that you do, what's the best way to get that information?
You can just hop over to twinflamesstudios.com and we are there. There's samples of our work. You can reach us there and we're happy to connect with you and explore, no matter where you're at in the process.
That's great. I will make sure that all the links are in the show notes here. Tina, this has been a pleasure. Thank you so much for taking the time today.
Thank you, Bruce.
Thank you for tuning in to today's episode. Be sure to subscribe using your favorite podcast app, so you don't miss our future episodes. See you next time.
About Scaling Up ServicesScaling Up Services is a podcast devoted to helping founders, partners, CEOs, key executives, and managers of service-based businesses scale their companies faster and with less drama. For more information and a list of recent episodes, please visit www.scalingupservices.com.
About Eckfeldt & AssociatesEckfeldt & Associates is a strategic coaching and advisory firm based in New York City and servicing growth companies around the world. Founded and led by Inc. 500 CEO Bruce Eckfeldt, E&A helps founders, CEOs, and leadership teams develop highly differentiated business strategies and create high-performance leadership teams who can execute with focus and rigor. Leveraging the Scaling Up, 3HAG, and Predictive Index toolsets, the firm has worked with a wide range of dynamic industries including technology, professional services, real estate, healthcare, pharmaceutical, and cannabis/hemp. For more information, please visit www.eckfeldt.com or email at info@eckfeldt.com.
Did you know one of the most powerful ways you can connect with your clients is through podcasting? You can learn more about the benefits of podcasting, what questions you need to answer before you begin your podcast, and how Twin Flames Studios helps get your voice into more ears on my guest interview with Bruce Eckfeldt on the Scaling Up Services podcast.(Scaling Up Services Podcast with Bruce Eckfeldt, October 2021)
Tina spoke with Bruce Eckfeldt on the Scaling Up Services podcast to discuss how podcasts hone your brand, provide evergreen marketing content, and create deeper relationships.
In this episode, you'll learn:
Why audio is one of the most intimate mediums for storytelling
The top questions to ask before you start your podcast
How podcasts can revitalize your marketing and expand your reach
Bruce Eckfeldt Are you a CEO looking to scale your company faster and easier? Check out Thrive Roundtable. Thrive combines a moderated peer group mastermind expert one on one coaching access to proven growth tools and a 24/7 support community. Created by Inc. award-winning CEO and certified Scaling Up Business coach, Bruce Eckfeldt, Thrive will help you grow your business more quickly and with less drama. For details on the program, visit eckfeldt.com/thrive.
Welcome, everyone. This is Scaling Up Services. I'm Bruce Eckfeldt. I'm your host. Our guest today isTina Dietz. She is the founder at Twin Flames Studios. We're going to talk to her about the work that she does with companies helping them with creating content, with promotion. This is a really kind of interesting topic. I think so many service companies based their marketing, based their sales and lead development, based on thought leadership and getting content out in the world. And there's so many different types of content and so many different ways you can do it. I really think they–obviously I love podcasting–but you know, podcasts, audiobooks, you know, spoken word kind of content, there's so many things you can do with it. There's so many things you can use to generate awareness, generate thought leadership, generate leads. I'm excited for this and excited to hear Tina’s story and how she got into this this world of audio content production and what she's been doing with service companies. So, with that, Tina, welcome to the program.
Tina DietzHey, Bruce, thanks for having me.
It's a pleasure having you on. So before we dive into what you're doing with Twin Flames right now and stuff, why don't we talk a little bit about you and get a sense of your background? Give us the story. What was your professional journey? And how did you get into what you're doing today?
Well, like most entrepreneurs, it's fairly stupid. It's just like, “Well, how the hell did this happen?” Yeah, yeah. And that's, and that's what we hear more than everything. If you had asked me, you know, when I was growing up, if, you know, in 25 years or whatever, you're going to own a company that produces audio content in the land of thought leadership for service-based companies. I'm sorry, what? What, what? It didn't even exist, right? You know, at the time?
So my upbringing was I had a younger sibling–that was a business. My parents owned a business that they started when I was three years old. It was my younger sibling, and I hated it. It was a wood burning stove and fireplace business. So real sexy, awesome. And basically, that was my constant companion growing up. So I was steeped like a tea bag in entrepreneurship. From a very young age, I started answering phones when I was four and going to trade shows when I was six, I do a whole talk will have to do another time maybe on how I found my purpose in life through the Ginsu knife demonstration at a local fair. So that’s a whole thing, that's the whole thing. And, you know, I never really thought I'd own a business, but I became a therapist–for a number of reasons. Childhood was not a great place. But you know, lessons learned. It's one of those things. And I've spent a lot of time in the world of personal development, in leadership and all of that. So cultivating myself, of course, created in me a desire to see what else could be done for other people.
That led me to coaching and consulting, which then ended up leading me to podcasting and ultimately to audio production. Basically, through a paid hobby I had as a voice actor. You know, I'm an entrepreneur, we can't have regular hobbies, we have to have hobbies that pay us. That's the way it works. We can't have normal hobbies. So I was a voice actor on the side and taking some classes and masterclasses in audiobook narration. And I had this chocolate and peanut butter moment, this light bulb, aha, that, “Oh, my God, why aren't all my clients and colleagues who are doing best selling campaigns and producing books, why aren't they doing audiobooks?” And that was, as Michael Gerber from The E Myth says, you know, my “entrepreneurial seizure” that led me to investigate the world of audio and led me to a big gap in the market and dove into that.
I took over my business within a year of starting to offer services in this big market gap of done-for-you audiobooks, and also the corporate side of podcasting. And that is kind of was the best decision that I ever made. And so I went from basically being a solopreneur, consultant who'd worked with more than 20 industries in eight countries to being the CEO of a company that now produces content in the land of audio that changes lives and hearts and minds for service-based companies and making sure that they're having this beautiful, human, authentic voice of their company that comes through this medium of audio.
Yeah, I'm curious. You've had a couple of different kind of pivots in your commercial world and career what are some of the things that you had to learn or had to kind of change about your thinking, your leadership, your approach during those pivots?
Bruce, I thought you said this was only a half hour podcast.
The top two. Just the top two.
The top two. One: choose who gets in your ear very carefully, very carefully. I'm very much of a happy puppy kind of person. I'm just like, “Yeah, let's do it. Let's change the world. Let's make it happen.” I have a lot of enthusiasm and energy and kind of that visionary habit–you see something and you want to make it happen. And it took me a long time to really learn how to vet the people that I was working with, or who I was throwing in with, because I assumed for a long time, in a very naive way, that everyone had the same values that I did around integrity and communication, and, you know, working together and making sure everybody wins. And it doesn't always work that day. Most people, most people, 99% of people on the planet are doing their best. But you know, problems and challenges that come up, don't always bring out the best in people. Sometimes it brings out the worst in people. And so learning how to create relationships over time and cultivate those relationships carefully has been a huge game changer in my world to keep things consistent and growing in the right direction.
And the other piece of the puzzle has been, you know, doing my own inner work. I'd say all the time that we were born with two voices: the voice you speak with and the voice that speaks to you. And working on the voice that speaks to me has made the biggest difference in anything that I've done as a leader, as a business owner, as a partner, a wife, a mom, you know, on any of that, to cultivate that inner world–and I could do many, many, many hours, and all the things that have happened there. But suffice to say it's been a journey.
That's a really great, that's a great realization. And yeah, I think it's, you know, time is your most precious commodity and where you spend it, you know, how you spend it, who you spend it with, are all kinds of things that are really going to influence your success and what you end up doing. Tell me a little bit about kind of why audio content? I mean, what's your kind of take on the world? You know, that we're in today? Why is audio content so powerful, so important? Why have you chosen to focus on it?
Well, going back to what I said a moment ago about our internet, our voices, it's something every human being on the planet is born with. And it's something that cannot be taken away. And speaking, as someone who has felt in the past that my voice was taken away and was suppressed, having that voice and having a place at the table to have that voice heard, is incredibly valuable. And so, everything that I have done, and what we do as a company with Twin Flames, is designed to give people a place at the table so that their voices are heard. And then it creates this incredible ripple effect that you know, podcasts and audiobooks are some of the lowest hanging fruit on the planet for people to start changing their lives.
If we can be a part of more leadership voices and more positive voices and more great information, reaching people all over the world, so that they can start to change their lives. That is a really powerful place to be. It is really about making the world a better place one kind of drip of audio at a time. And audio is very, very, very intimate compared to most other forms of media. It's single focus. Most people listen to audio right into their ear. So there is a neurological connection that's very powerful between, you know, the earbud I have in my ear, and the center of my brain, the amygdala, the hippocampus, all of those things. It's not just higher brain functions being impacted by the voice. And so there's an intimacy created in an impact that's really important. And storytelling, of course, is incredibly powerful worldwide. It's something that connects all of humanity. So when we bring all these factors together, neurological, you know, storytelling, how we're wired, the universal power of the human voice to create relationship–it's a very, very powerful medium. And it can be used in so many different ways and sliced and diced, and at the pace we're living at, you know, audio is the most portable form of media. You can listen when you can't read you can listen when you can't watch. So you know, it's never gone away. It's never going to go away. And all of those things together make it what I consider the perfect storm for perfect content.
Yeah, I was like that idea that audio content literally gets you in your prospect’s head.
Mm-hmm. Yeah, you got it.
So what are all the kinds of formats these days? I mean, we kind of went from you know, I date myself accidentally when I say I'm listening to a book on tape or something.
I know, right? Me too.
It's morphed so many times, like what is your kind of how do you kind of lay out the scope or the types of audio content that that you have at your disposal these days?
Well, we usually start with a primary form of content, which is generally a podcast. Podcasting, of course, is something that is hot right now. I’m on one as we speak, and it provides a nice bulk of content to start with, and a framework to start with. So unlike a video, the average video watcher will watch two minutes, but the average podcast listener will listen for 40 minutes.
And it's actually much harder to create short form content than it is slightly longer form content. We have thoughts, you know, curating what we say, you know, the brevity or like cutting things down to its core is much more challenging than this kind of a conversational format. And so, it allows people to be very natural, and very expansive in what they're talking about to dig into nitty gritty and to know that the listener is still going to be interested more than two minutes in, so you're not trying to pack things in. So we start with a longer form 20-30 minute podcast, usually sometimes longer, sometimes shorter, but that's on average what it is. And that gives us a lovely bulk of content to work with.
From there, there's all different ways to slice and dice that type of content, repurpose it, reuse it. And the authenticity that comes through when you're using audio and using this type of format is really important to reach people on a deeper basis, rather than just an informational basis.
Yeah. And when you look at companies, what are I guess, what are some of the companies or situations that are best served with audio content? Like who can really benefit from this form of content?
Well, we love working with relationship-focused, service-based companies. People who, when they're working with their clients, they have long-term relationships with their clients. For example, companies, which seem very dry, but there's a lot of content available in the financial world, in insurance, for example, education of varying kinds, and even things like retail, retail conglomerates, and things like that, that are creating more experiences. Travel can be served in this way, as well, although it does, definitely does need to be paired with the visual aspect as well. But it can be really, really, really beautiful. You will see a lot of influencer podcasting, that's generally not our super cup of tea.
We do a lot of work in the leadership space, though, helping to humanize brands that are large, and give the brand an avatar because we don't really do business with faceless, nameless corporations. We want to do business with people. So being able to communicate brand values and culture and leadership and innovation through the avatar of a podcast host is extremely powerful. Another industry that benefits a lot from podcasting is healthcare. And all of these have constraints with compliance and communication and legal and all of that. But we're able to navigate all of those waters, as well.
Yeah, yeah. So what are some of the other challenges? If you are interested in developing audio content? Like what do you need to kind of consider or think about setup?
The lift is largely at the beginning when you're–well with any type of content, right, so you have to decide that has enough value that you're going to spend the brain capacity and the bandwidth and the time to work with a company like ours, so that we can help you shape that voice and shape the type of content that's really going to benefit you. So choosing that it's going to be a priority.
And then having deep, intimate communication and regular awesome content are things that you really want to do, you also need to decide in terms of you know–and we work with our companies on this–like who's going to be hosting, who's your avatar, who's your people or person that you're going to be featuring. And there's a lot of creative ways to work with that scenario, as well. Everything from solo hosts to two hosts to a panel discussion and everything in between. There's, there's a lot of different ways to manage those kinds of questions, particularly if there's multiple people inside of a company who want to be at the forefront being that avatar for the company, that's all completely manageable.
Another thing the company really needs to decide is if their marketing department, and their team, how we're going to dovetail this with their other strategic initiatives. Podcasting should be one piece and audio should be a piece of a larger strategic picture for a company. It should never be a band-aid or just an outlier. It needs to be integrated because it is something that has high strategic value, and can augment or replace creating content in other areas like blog posts, social media post images, articles for industry publications, and even events and getting used in events in different ways. So, there's a lot of applications and being willing to dive into the strategy is super important.
And what goes into that strategy? What questions are you asking or what do companies need to think about, you know, in terms of understanding kind of the bigger picture strategy before they really get into, you know, executing a particular kind of audio content strategy?
Yeah, we like to get into working with their marketing team. and finding out what are their core values that they're looking to communicate. What is that mission? What is their vision for their company, and then building out kind of an avatar of their host, not of their audience, but of their host. You know, if you had to personify your company, who is kind of that person and that spokesperson to do that? That's certainly an area that we start with, we also need to look at, as I mentioned, their current strategic initiatives. What's already working for them in terms of their marketing? How can podcasting build upon that and make it even more robust? And what are their pain points that we can address that are challenging?
So one of the pain points we run into a lot with companies is just the generation of content to begin with, particularly from a very busy team. A larger company, you know, when you ask somebody to go and say, “Hey, would you write a blog post on this?” somebody who's a technician or a salesperson or whatever, they may not be a writer to do that. Using interview techniques, we can extract and pull really wonderful, real conversational information from team members that can be pulled into podcasting content, or then even turned into articles or ebooks or, you know, other types of content, as well. And the creation process becomes 100 times easier. And this is, of course, scalable for any size company to do that, whether we're working with a sales team, or we're working with, you know, a CPA firm.
Yeah. You mentioned a couple times the idea of leveraging the content, what are some ways that you can kind of use the, the initial content, leverage it in different ways? You know, repurpose it. What are some things that companies should be thinking about when they develop a kind of a content strategy, starting with audio content?
Sure, I'll kind of walk you through a whole process, potential process flow on that. So let's say your podcast gets made, and the audio content is going out to 20-30 different audio distribution platforms, everything from Spotify to Apple podcasts and whatnot. So it lives all out in the world of public podcasting. Well, then the full edited transcript of that podcast, along with an embedded player, which has a number of features on it that are really helpful for the listener, click to tweets, and custom captioned images are all embedded on the website, usually in the form of a blog post. So we have, first, fresh content that goes into your blog.
And secondly, this is all gorgeous for your search engine optimization. Google loves fresh, long form conversational content, because Google is moving towards AI for their search engine optimization. This longer form conversational podcast content is so helpful for SEO, particularly with all the bells and whistles to kind of go along with it. So, from there, you can take the we have always have a little summary at the top and we have our quotes that are pulled out. Those are repurposed into social media posts, usually either on say a company page on LinkedIn that are then shared with the employees, shared with the team so that then they all can share those posts as well.
We also pull out short clips, little highlights from the podcast and turn them into what are called audiograms, which are little shareable, closed-caption dynamic videos. Those are also shared on social media. And one of my other favorite places to use audiograms is to embed them in related blog posts on the site that aren't necessarily the podcast episode, but maybe related content. So then you are cross-pollinating your website content and also creating a more dynamic experience for somebody visiting your website, because now you've got this lovely little 30-second to one minute long video that's breaking up the content on a related post and maybe getting people interested in staying on your website longer. Yeah, so those are just a few of the things that you can do.
We even recommend that whoever is the guest on the podcast, or even the host, depending on the situation, repurpose the link to their podcast on the publication section of their LinkedIn profile. A lot of people only use articles or blog posts, but you can use your podcast interviews as part of your publications list. And that helps build out, of course, your LinkedIn presence. For those folks of us who are in the B2B world or in the, you know, the business world. It's really nice to have that additional fresh content on your LinkedIn profile to kind of keep you top of mind for people.
So those are just a couple. Those are just a couple elements. And the other big one we see a lot of is turning podcast content into industry publication articles. So basically having writers–either folks we've introduced you to, or folks on their team. One of our companies that we work with primary tax solutions, they're a specialty tax company, and they've now had six articles based on their podcasts–content produced and published in publications like Accounting Today.
Yeah, I love that idea is like you create one piece and then you can find lots of different ways. Oh, my goodness repurposing it makes it so much easier or just create so much more leverage in terms of the work you do. What are some of the challenges? Certainly, when I started podcasting, you know, it wasn't, there was some hesitation and trepidation about kind of really getting into this and putting myself out there like that. What do you do to help folks who, you know, are considering this, but they're not quite sure they have maybe some, you know, maybe a little bit of fear around some of this stuff. You know, creating this content, really putting it out there–what are ways in which you help them kind of evaluate and create an opportunity for them to really get into this space?
It really just, it lives in the world of conversation. So, Bruce, would it be accurate to say that, you know, one of your big considerations was time?
Oh, absolutely.
Yeah, yeah. And that's really the biggest thing we have to talk about is, where are your priorities, and where is your time going to be, because even if we're handling 90% of what has to go into the podcast production, we're still going to need, you know, some time for the marketing team and of course, the host and things like that to spend some time in that arena. So it just really has to be a priority, and they need to be well suited. So there's a lot of evaluation that goes on at the beginning, everything from talking about, like I said, the creation of kind of this avatar. We even use thought leadership archetypes that we have developed based on the 12 Jungian archetypes to help kind of shape the brand of the podcast in conjunction with the company's brand to make sure that there's this consistent voice.
So everything that we do really lives in relationship and inquiry and curiosity. And and then from there, the strategy, but we come at it–I would say that, you know, a lot of times I'm practicing my “Business Buddha” and that means I come from a place of non-attachment. It really has to be all about the clients and not about us and seeing what's going to be best. And sometimes it's not the best solution for that company, or it's not the right time. Sometimes it's the absolute perfect time, and the company is absolutely 100% ready to go. Sometimes there's a little bit of a delay until a few ducks get in a row and we say, “Hey, you know, you really should have X, Y, and Z handled before we start this process.” So it always has to be in the best interest of the company, so that we can get the best product, because, as you know, Bruce, podcasting isn't a one and done deal. It's a long tail game. Yeah, you know, so we got to have time.
Yeah, no, let's dig into that just a little bit. ‘Cause I find I see a lot of podcasts out there that get to like episode eight.
Yeah.
You know, big plans, big ideas, and then, you know, just, you know, a big initial push, but, they just kind of fade quickly. What are some things that can help you to prevent that or will help you, you know, kind of be in it for the long game?
Well, most of our companies, we recommend starting with a bi-weekly schedule, instead of a weekly schedule. You can always add episodes. You can always add frequency as you go. But bi-weekly gives enough frequency for folks to really get content out on a regular basis without it necessarily being an overwhelming time commitment. We also work to develop out the content calendar, and make sure that we've actually got, you know, 12 or 24 potential episodes kind of planned out. And then many times we're helping with, you know, getting the guests on. You know, let's look at your networking list. Who do you want to have on and how can we help you facilitate that communication, the guest preparation and making the actual recording process as easy as possible for folks? You know, you and I both use an interface that's very easy to get on. You're using was it Tricast here. Is that what we're both on?
Yeah.
So Tricast, Squadcast, Riverside FM–there's a bunch of them that really helped make the recording process very high quality and very easy, no matter who you are, where you are, as long as you've got a relatively decent internet connection. Yeah, and we help facilitate those with live direction, sometimes, helping people actually kind of feel comfortable, relax them. We do episode preparation sometimes and actually create the outlines for episodes for companies and working with their marketing team to make it easier for them to just have a nice flow of every episode. And of course, any kind of host or guest training when it comes down to the actual vocal or interview side of things. It's really a matter of finding out what are the needs, what are the desires, and creating the right solutions to fill it. There's no cookie cutter solution.
Yeah. And are most of your clients looking to develop leads for like a lead funnel or what are the outcomes that sort of the tangible business outcomes that you're typically focused on with clients?
The tangible outcomes that clients are usually looking to focus on are multifold. Podcasting of this particular kind is a beautiful combination of relationship marketing, influence marketing, and content marketing. So we're looking to have guests chosen strategically that are not necessarily leads for their company–there's a whole philosophy of podcasting that you interview people you want to have as clients. That's not really where we live. The companies that we work with are well-established. They're doing very, very well in their fields. And this is really a move from having a brand to becoming thought leaders in an industry. So it has more to do with influence and high quality content than it does with directly getting leads.
But that being said, it usually–well, actually, it always–it always ends up in developing leads, because collaborations come out of the guests that you have on the show, out of the visibility that you have, out of the elevation in the industry of now becoming a media presence, all of those things happen, and it is largely because podcasting opens doors when it comes to relationships. You know, our clients are always looking to have high quality guests on their show, and then following up with those guests afterwards to help deepen that relationship and develop collaboration inevitably adds leads to additional opportunities and more leads 100% of the time.
Yeah. And what recommendations do you have for folks in terms of kind of picking subjects, things that you're going to weave into your conversations, finding guests? I mean, how do you go from, “Hey, I want to start a podcast, I want to, you know, have these sort of business outcomes,” to actually getting things scheduled and figuring out what you're going to talk about?
Oh, okay, that's a big world. So let's break it down just into a couple of first steps. One is to look at your values. What do you want to be known for? You know, who are you in in the world? What does your company want to be known for? And what are your brand values, the pillars that you operate by that you want to make sure it get communicated out to an audience?
Then there's a little bit of a Venn diagram. You've got your brand values and your culture, and then you have what you're really good at, you know, what's your areas of focus, and you're going to overlap those two areas on each other. And then the third area that you're going to your trifecta, a little three circle Venn diagram is going to be how do you want to communicate it?
So when you're talking about podcasting, you have to have somebody on your team who's got a proclivity towards a microphone. In some way, shape or form, they have to have a desire for it. Because otherwise you're going to end up you know, like, like Ben Stein in Ferris Bueller's Day Off. “Bueller, Bueller? Bueller?” It's got to be dynamic, right? You somebody who is inclined. So that you know, so then you got your format of your show. So you've got those three pieces that you want overlap to find kind of your sweet spot in podcasting. And I will say, that's where you start. Podcasting is one of those things, just like I hate to say it, a website. That is, you're always evolving over time, and you're going to have seasons. You're going to have segments, you're going to evolve it over time. So you got to start with where you're most comfortable and most seasoned in your expertise, and then you're going to evolve and grow it from there.
Tina, this has been a pleasure if people want to find out more about you about the work that you do, what's the best way to get that information?
You can just hop over to twinflamesstudios.com and we are there. There's samples of our work. You can reach us there and we're happy to connect with you and explore, no matter where you're at in the process.
That's great. I will make sure that all the links are in the show notes here. Tina, this has been a pleasure. Thank you so much for taking the time today.
Thank you, Bruce.
Thank you for tuning in to today's episode. Be sure to subscribe using your favorite podcast app, so you don't miss our future episodes. See you next time.
About Scaling Up ServicesScaling Up Services is a podcast devoted to helping founders, partners, CEOs, key executives, and managers of service-based businesses scale their companies faster and with less drama. For more information and a list of recent episodes, please visit www.scalingupservices.com.
About Eckfeldt & AssociatesEckfeldt & Associates is a strategic coaching and advisory firm based in New York City and servicing growth companies around the world. Founded and led by Inc. 500 CEO Bruce Eckfeldt, E&A helps founders, CEOs, and leadership teams develop highly differentiated business strategies and create high-performance leadership teams who can execute with focus and rigor. Leveraging the Scaling Up, 3HAG, and Predictive Index toolsets, the firm has worked with a wide range of dynamic industries including technology, professional services, real estate, healthcare, pharmaceutical, and cannabis/hemp. For more information, please visit www.eckfeldt.com or email at info@eckfeldt.com.
You woke up feeling great this morning, but as you’ve completed projects and spoken with colleagues, you find yourself running out of steam. You feel burdened, anxious, or drained. Something is off. Why? You may be experiencing the effects of “emotional velcro.”
As we interact with others throughout the day, the emotions we encounter leave a residue on us because we are by nature empathic beings. Let’s say, for example, that your spouse has a stressful morning and you’re wondering how their afternoon is going or one of your team members feels stuck about an upcoming project and takes you into their confidence, seeking advice. Those emotions aren’t yours, but they can stick to you like velcro and color every interaction you have for the rest of the day. Emotional velcro has a compounding effect because when we are weighed down by it, we also leave our own emotional velcro behind for others to bear. If left unaddressed, emotional velcro hinders our ability to effectively communicate, influences our team’s emotional state and, ultimately, diminishes our leadership ability.
The good news is we can clear the emotional velcro we pick up and reclaim our energy while still being empathetic leaders. By clarifying our emotions, determining a strategy to process them and intentionally choosing our emotional states, we successfully manage our own emotions and maximize our emotional elasticity (our ability to emotionally adapt and engage). Furthermore, clearing our own emotional velcro ensures we continuously communicate with transparency and integrity, which means we do not transfer any emotional velcro to our team. As we lead by example, we contribute to creating a culture and workplace of psychological safety for our teams.
In order to accomplish these goals, there are a number of strategies we can use. Here are three to consider:
1. Self-evaluate.
Ask yourself, “Why am I feeling this way? Is there anything I am carrying that is not mine to bear?” Distinguishing if an emotion is yours or not is sometimes enough to release the velcro for us. In other situations, what someone else is going through may trigger some emotions of our own that may need to be readdressed. In either case, discerning what the source of the emotional velcro is and who it belongs to can bring either immediate relief or give us an opening for an empowered next step.
2. Self-address.
Address the struggle that the interaction has uncovered by getting curious about solutions and taking action. Sometimes, the solution is that we need to talk with someone else like a coach, counselor or other trusted source. Other times, we simply need to combat the issue with the truth about ourselves or the situation.
3. Shift your emotional state.
We have the power to learn to intentionally shift our emotional states. Just like learning to read or catch a ball, this is a skill set that simply takes practice — and that practice is not something most of us have consciously had before. Intentionally shifting does not mean denying what we are feeling or not caring about others; rather, it means consciously choosing and embodying an emotional state so we are not weighed down by emotional velcro. Embodiment techniques vary, and ample research exists explaining why they can be so effective. According to a study from the University of Tennessee at Knoxville, when we smile, it can actually help us feel happier. We can also use simple vocal techniques and “power poses” to release the stress we are feeling.
Engaging in this process of self-evaluating, self-addressing and shifting maximizes our emotional elasticity and brings more psychological safety to ourselves and the people around us as we lead by example. We may not be stress-free and revitalized overnight, but every time we “reset,” we are able to shift our emotional state more easily and more quickly. This allows us to establish deeper, more authentic connections with our team, be more present and pour into them from a place of wholeness, instead of scarcity. Psychologically safe workplaces begin with leadership. Shed your emotional velcro and see what happens.
Read and watch more Frequently Asked Questions about Audiobooks and benefit from our expertise, or Contact Us for more information and forthright advice about producing, distributing, and profiting from Audiobooks. Plus, download our Vocal Leadership Workout to develop and refine your the most influential tool you have — your voice!
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
In this quick video, I share with you some mysteries behind microphones and give you some recording tips to improve your podcast sound quality
Tina Dietz
Hi guys, it's Tina Dietz from Twin Flames Studios, and I wanted to do a really quick video for you on microphone technique, because I hear microphone issues constantly—particularly on new podcasts—but even on longstanding podcasts.
And there's a few things that are very small that you need to be sure that you're doing with your microphone.So, first of all, this is a Yeti. Yeti is one of the most popular microphones on the market. A lot of people have one. I've been using one for years. Even though I've got other ones floating around, I do come back to the Yeti because it's familiar and lovely.One of the biggest issues with the Yeti people don't know is that it is a side presentation microphone—you don't speak into the top of the Yeti, you talk into the side of it. The other thing that happens a lot with the Yeti, as well as many other microphones, is you may have what's called the gain adjusted wrong. Gain is sometimes a button or dial on the microphone; sometimes it's in the software. The gain has to do with how much volume, or how much that your microphone is taking in. And you want to have that generally set about halfway. Not too low, not too high. Sometimes you have to experiment with it.On a microphone like the Yeti there's also different settings on the back—read the directions. Usually, for podcasting, you use the cardioid, which is the little heart symbol on the back. There's different settings on the Yeti because it is an omnidirectional microphone—you can have a bunch of people sitting around it to get sound.This is in contrast to a top presentation microphone, which—if you have a microphone that looks anything like this—and most microphones are a top presentation microphone. So, a microphone like this—this is a Samson—you would speak into the top of it, not the side of it. So, one of the biggest issues of Yeti—the sound isn't here; it's here. So, make sure you're doing it right.The other thing is, are you close enough to the mic? When we're on video like this, I'm sitting back kind of far from the microphone, and you know, you might be getting a sound. If I'm recording a podcast, I don't want to be that far away. I'm going to take a hang loose sign; I am going to put my pinky finger on the microphone; I'm going to put my thumb on my lip. And that is as far away as I should be from the microphone.If you want to create an even more intimate sound as long as you don't get too loud—because it'll pop your sound waves—you can even get in a little bit closer. And you can probably hear in the sound quality that there is a difference here when you get right up on the mic.
If you have a lot of popping and sibilance—you'll hear that right there—on your microphone, you want to make sure you do have a guard on it like this—a foam one or a screen one. They will help with the sibilance; we can also do some in post-production.And I'm also speaking in a room that is quite big—high ceiling, all of that. I'm going to get a lot of room noise. I'm going to get a lot of reverb. So, when you are recording, think about recording either in a smaller space with soft cloth or, you know, acoustic tiles on your walls. Record in your walk-in-closet—it's a great space to do recording. Just don't use video.And for God's sake, stop using Zoom for your podcasts. Even as a producer, I can tell you we have used Zoom for our podcasts in the past. We have stopped doing it. Because all of the changes in the software of the platform, they are over-compressing the sound quality. We're not getting good quality out of Zoom anymore. So consider using a podcast platform like Squadcast.fm—that's the one we use for our clients, Squadcast.fm. That is not a paid plug. It's a really easy to use format. There are a bunch of other ones out there as well, that are going to be better than Zoom.Audio and video—very different. We'll talk about that in another video. But I wanted to talk with you—since I'm seeing so many podcasts launching here in 2021—about some quick microphone techniques. These are very, very basic. There's a lot more we can go into, but if that's helpful to you—I really hope it is and hopefully that'll improve a little bit of your sound quality on your new podcast.Talk to you soon.
Tune in to episode 111 of The Creative Impostor podcast, hosted by Andrea Klunder. We will show you how to amplify your message(Podcast on The Creative Impostor, August 9, 2020)
Episode 111. “In this phase of growth, it feels weird. It feels nebulous. It feels like this molting bird… Sometimes it takes as long as it takes, you know, it's not the enlightenment Olympics.” ~Tina Dietz
This episode is for the birds. Or rather, about birds. More accurately, how much creative humans have in common with molting parrots.
Hang with me; this episode isn't wall-to-wall ornithology talk. I recorded my conversation with Vocal Leadership Expert and Podcast Host Tina Dietz way back in the before-times. Still, her message about self-acceptance and faith in our creative evolution rings doubly true at a time when putting our trust in anything is a struggle.
She just happens to equate this transition with shedding feathers.
As founder and CEO of Twin Flames Studios, Tina molds (not molts) experts into influencers, teaching clients how to amplify their message. Whether it's through their own podcasts, as guests of other shows, or as in-demand speakers, Tina's vocal leadership expertise goes beyond the simple correction of speech mechanics.
Transitions rarely come without challenges. There's the macro level, global shifts taking place right now, and then there are the awkward personal doubts and missteps.
You're not wrong for feeling vulnerable. Massive life changes force us to question our personal and professional identities.
Here are five steps you, as a content generator, can take to find your book inside your blog (and inside your other content, too.)
“We all have a book inside us,” as Dana Micheli, fellow ghostwriter points out. I agree with her, but I also believe that content generators, who are practically manifesting material in their sleep, already have a book outside of them. They just don’t know it…yet.
I consider a content generator a business owner or entrepreneur with an abundant blog, LinkedIn articles for days, keynote addresses and speeches filling up digital file folders, transcripts of every interview they’ve ever done (podcast or otherwise), and copies of any free eBook, presentation, or article they’ve ever written. Whether they’ve generated all this content themselves, or benefited from the support and talent from content writers, copywriters, and/or ghostwriters, the fact is this: They are sitting on a content gold mine, each piece a precious gem, and part of a book just waiting to be produced.
I’m fortunate to work with clients who believe in the power of content and who leverage me to help grow and nurture their mines. Most of them want to produce their first book (or next) but struggle with repurposing their content or searching for the parts and pieces to produce a book—a book that is focused, well-written, showcases their expertise, offers value to their audience, and boosts their business credibility and brand.
Here are five steps a content generator can take to find a book inside their blog (and any of their other content, too).
STEP 1: Identify Topical or Thematic Threads and Trends
List all the places where content exists and visit these locations. Review headings (and subheadings) and scan your content. Note keywords and other recurring ideas that you notice.
Rank your discovered themes/topics and choose the one that speaks to you the most, or aligns with your brand and vision for your business. By going through this process, you’ve found the focus of your book. (You’ll also likely find the most precious gems: the stuff you once wrote that really shined above the rest. Hopefully, those pieces make it into your final work.)
STEP 2: Define Your Reader and Relevance
Now that you’ve identified your topic, pull together copies of each piece of related content. Scan the content and ask yourself: who is my ideal audience? Why is this topic relevant to them? What will they get in reading this information? How is it different and new from what already exists? To take this one step further, envision all this content in its final version (a beautiful book with your name on it) and reflect on what your intended goals / hopes / outcomes are for this book.
STEP 3: Outline Your Table of Contents
Determine where you believe you want your reader to begin and to end. Mark the beginning as A on a piece of paper, and write B on the other side. You’ll fill in the outline of A to B as you read your content again, and this will become your table of contents. Now, this time, you’re not going to just look at content online. Print everything relevant to your topic. Read each piece then set it aside (temporarily). Yes, this may take you some time. You’re mining for the gold here. What are the relevant pieces that really stand out? How do you see these pieces creating an arc of the work? Organize your content based on how to get the reader from point A to B. List the titles of each individual piece in your outline according to how you think they should be ordered.
STEP 4: Investigate Gaps and Goodness
Pinpoint what’s missing and what’s already kicking butt. Read your content from start to finish in the order you outlined. Record what is working (‘goodness’) about what isn’t (‘gaps’). Make a plan for addressing the gaps. This may mean reading it out loud to yourself, taking some time away from the draft, running it through spell check, asking a friend to proofread, etc.
STEP 5: Polish Before Your Publish
Polish your work so it’s crystal clear and shines like a diamond. It’s time to fine-tune things before you publish—no matter what publication route you go. When you’ve finished addressing the gaps, read the full manuscript for clarity, cohesion, and flow. Mark the text where adjustments need to be made. Proofread with an eye for spelling, grammar, punctuation, etc., and review for formatting and styling consistency. Solicit the feedback of others you trust to give you a professional and critical eye, and assess if you achieved your goals.
You have now finished mining a book out of your voluminous mountain of content.
If you need some extra support with these five steps, you can snatch up my free gift, Finding Your Book Inside Your Blog: A Content Master’s Scavenger Hunt & Field Guide to Find the Pieces to Produce Your Book.
Alyssa Berthiaume is a native Vermonter, professional (and creative) writer, practicing feminist, recovering middle child, wannabe superhero, and a mom who’s pretty sure she’s “winging it” most of the time. She’s the leading Lady (Boss) and ghostwriter at The Write Place, Right Time – her virtual boutique of writing services for badass coaches, trainers, and speakers, and other badass entrepreneurs who don't “do words” but know they need them. To know more about how she can “do words” for you, visit her website.
Alyssa Berthiaume– Copywriting, Ghostwriting, Lady Boss and Owner of The Write Place, Right Time
Tina Dietz joins Paul Higgins to share how you can refine their vocal leadership and turn your voice into a weapon for good. Tune in!(Podcast on Build Live Give, May, 2020)
Aside from entertainment, part of the value of being a coach or a public speaker is the education and the inspiration that you provide. For Tina Dietz, going deep into the world of audio was her way of being of service to other people and the path to having a scalable company. Tina is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and influence and vocal leadership expert. Her company, Twin Flames Studios, amplifies the influence of leaders, experts, and companies around the globe. Today, she joins Paul Higgins to share how one can refine their vocal leadership and turn their voice into a weapon for good. If you’re into voice acting, public speaking, or anything that involves talking, tune in to this episode and be inspired to get your voice and message out to the people who need to hear them.
Listen to the podcast here:
Vocal Leadership: Turning Your Voice Into a Weapon for Good with Tina Dietz
Build Live Give. Mentoring With Paul Higgins
Our guest is someone who worked in social enterprise and loved teaching, which led to improving the lives of others. She then started to work in their family business because they knew that they couldn’t continue to work for others. As a hobby in the background, she was a paid voice actor and having deep entrepreneurial roots, particularly from her parents, she looked on how to monetize it. She has been helping leaders share their wisdom through voice ever since. You will experience firsthand how to do an on-air ad. I love this episode and I hope you do as well. Get three tips to improving your podcast, where the podcasting industry is headed and how you can benefit and also how LinkedIn has become a virtual conference and the way that you can participate in it. I’ll hand you over to Tina Dietz from Twin Flames Studios.
_
Welcome, Tina Dietz, to the show. It’s great to have you on.
Thanks for having me, Paul.
I’ve been looking forward to this interview for a long time given your experience. Why don’t we start with something that your family or friends would know about you that we may not?
If you get to know me and you end up coming over to my house, I love having people over for dinner. I’ve often had people say that I’m an Italian grandmother in training, which I take as a great compliment. I often, to unwind, we’ll do what I call kitchen karaoke, which is turning on karaoke while I’m cooking in the kitchen and encouraging other people to join along. These are full performance karaoke because it’s much more important to be as free and as ridiculous as possible. I find this incredibly therapeutic, so I’m bursting into song at a moment’s notice—it's something you have to watch out for if we want to be friends.
Does this include dress ups? Do you take it that far?
Yes, in an ideal world.
What are you doing to supplement this fantastic gift that you have? Because in Australia, we can’t have people over for dinner.
I’m not doing “instead of”—it’s more of an “also and”—my kids know that they either need to enjoy it, join in, or leave. Those are your three choices in this scenario. It depends on their mood. My husband, it's the same thing. He fortunately will join in. Sometimes I do have friends and colleagues, occasionally family members join me over video for ridiculousness. We’ve been known to show up in weird costumes or makeup or things like that. My beloved husband has allowed me—his facial hair grows quickly, but he’s usually clean-shaven—and I’ve even talked him into growing out his facial hair for a week or two so that I can do ridiculous things with it and give him different looks. He’s been tolerant.
I know you started—I’ll summarize it by “social enterprises”—working for them for quite some time. In 2014, you launched Twin Flames Studios. Take us a little bit through the transition of working for others to now running your own business.
I stepped off into working for myself several iterations before Twin Flame Studios. I was a therapist by training, but grew up as an entrepreneur and spent a number of years trying to work with other people, not having a good time dealing with bureaucracy. I started a family business with my dad. People always say to me, “When you were business coaching years ago, why didn’t you specialize in the family business?” I said, “Because I would like to remain sane and unmedicated.” A family business is a particular animal and I grew up in a family business—I love my father and I definitely would not do that again. Where I learned online business—where I cut my teeth on that—was with a company called the Nayada Institute of Massage. She’s a very gifted massage therapist. I started my business coaching and consulting. I worked on that for many years and then took a turn when I wanted to scale my company into audiobooks and podcasting because of my deep and abiding love of microphones.
When I read through your LinkedIn profile—and we know each other through a group we’re both in—it did seem like a bit of a leap out of nowhere. Fill that little leap in for us.
It’s not just the karaoke. I’ve been in favor of anything involving a microphone since I was small. Part of what I loved about being a coach, being out as a public speaker and everything was being on stage. The entertainment value, as well as the education and the inspiration that goes along with that. I had been taking voice acting lessons and ended up picking up an agent and having a paid hobby in voice acting on the side. I took some masterclasses in audiobook narration. Because being an entrepreneur, I can’t just have a hobby, I have to have a hobby you can monetize! I had a light bulb go off in that moment as I was finishing up that series of courses, “Why aren’t all my colleagues and clients who are doing books and bestseller launches doing audiobooks?”
That set off what Michael Gerber from TheE-Myth would call an “entrepreneurial seizure,” and I couldn’t let it go. I couldn’t put it down. It was one of those things. I got excited, and it still took me several years to come back around to allowing myself to create this new branch of a company because it did seem like such a disconnect. I even had business coaches tell me, “Why do you want to do ‘done for you' services that are going to damage your reputation as a subject matter expert?” I was like, “Why can’t I have it all? Why can’t I have both?” It was when I allowed myself to go into the niche, and allow myself to go deep into this world of audio and being of service to other people and having a scalable company that everything took a major turn for me, both as an expert, and in terms of the financial success of the company.
I’ve got many questions I could ask, but one of them is, you seem like a natural speaker and I find that a lot of people from the US are eloquent. It seems natural for them, whereas a lot of people in other countries don’t find that. Certainly for me, when I first started doing my show, I couldn’t stand the sound of my own voice. Give people some tips on how you get over not being able to stand listening to your own voice.
When I speak—and I’ll ask quite often the question, “How many of you don’t like the sound of your own voice?”—in a room of executives and whatnot, almost everybody in the room will raise their hand. Even in rooms of podcasters or public speakers, I get more than half the room. It’s a human thing because of the resonance of our skull structure. We sound foreign to ourselves, when you hear yourself on tape. It’s displacing and disorienting. It feels like you’re listening to an alien. When people don’t like the sound of their own voice, most of the time it’s because you have this incongruency and the brain hates incongruency.
To fix that, truly what it is—it’s repetition. You have to get used to it. Sometimes I’ll have people listen back to the sound of their own voice and say nice things back to themselves about what they like about their voice. Another good way to do it is to record something where you are saying something nice to yourself. Having somebody read off a whole series of affirmations, for example: “I am worthy. Every day I’m getting better,” and so on and so forth. Give them a list, have them read a recording of that, and then play back that recording because then you’re talking to yourself in a positive way. You’re creating a new voice in your head that likes you. You start to associate the sound of your voice with positive things and that’s helpful all the way around. In this particular case, the only way out is through liking your own voice, because that’s completely a subjective judgment. I guarantee you, nobody out there has ever hung up on anybody who’s listening to this show because, “I can’t stand the sound of your voice. I’m not talking to you.”
I cheat a little bit because if I do listen to myself, I listen at 2½, 3 times speed for most things. I build it up over time. It must’ve sounded a lot better at two times. If you’re currently listening at one, just dial it up a bit. Let’s be fair. That’s for the solo shows. Tina sounds much better at one time.
So, hobbies and monetizing them. There are a lot of people that are going through very unprecedented times and some of them may be thinking this might be the big time to take a leap, “I’m going to leave my job and I’m going to go create.” Any tips on how you start to monetize that hobby?
I have a little bit of two minds about this because I truly don’t believe that the whole ‘follow your passion and the money will follow’ is true. There’s a little more thinking to it than that because there are certain things that we do that we love that if we had to make a living from them, it might kill the creativity. That’s one of the things you have to consider. When I was coming up with this whole idea around the audiobooks, the podcasting, everything, I had to step back and consider, “Where does this come from? Why is this important? Why do I want to do this?” Is it the burning passion that I want to do for the rest of my life? No, but it’s a medium that I can make a contribution in.
I can help people get their voices out to the people who need to hear them. That for me, from a values perspective, is important. It’s more important to look at—what are your values? What are you creating? How is it going to fulfill those values? It’s the first thing to look at. The second thing is you have to be able to consider the ramifications of stepping off. I’ve helped many people through this transition, back when I was business coaching. There comes a point where the pain of staying and doing something you don’t love is greater than the pain of dealing with the financial impact. It’s very much an existential thing.
At the same time, if you can have a backup, if you can have a bridge, if you can have savings, if you can have something there and create a plan—or at least have some proof that what you’re stepping off into is possible for you to monetize—before you leave a comfortable job. Side hustles are great. Side hustles are important, but I don’t recommend that anybody step off into their side hustle as a job and into a whole enterprise until they’ve proven to themselves that they can make at least $1,000 a month from that enterprise. There needs to be some proof that you’ve got some “engine” going.
I wish I had heard that Tina back in 2011 because I did the complete opposite. One day a director at Coca-Cola the next day, who am I? I walked into a room and like, “I don’t know what I’m doing, let alone explain it to somebody else.” That’s great advice. Speaking of advice and supporters. You talked about your dad and working with your dad. You eloquently didn’t end all of that sentence, if your dad’s reading this—but who else supported you through this journey?
Because I have entrepreneurial parents, they were supportive of this particular journey. My kids’ dad, who I was married to at the time, through this whole beginning process of starting a business and going through different iterations of the business. I had a lot of side hustles before I decided to step off into my own thing full-time. I didn’t take all my own advice, but I did have clients and I did have a proven framework. I had a tremendous amount of failure, also, in different things. I was able to keep going. He was supportive in all the ways that he knew how to be. We had young children at the time and everything and he’s a great dad. I’m forever grateful for that support. Then the people who didn’t understand, who aren’t entrepreneurs and they didn’t quite get what was going on—at least they weren’t cruel or dismissive. I’ve had people come back to me over the years and go, “I got it.” I’m grateful for that as well.
I find for any of my friends, unfortunately in Australia often, they receive a redundancy. The next call is normally for me: “How do you make money by being in your track pants at home?” I know exactly what you’re saying with that transition. The next section is the “Build” section. We’ve already talked about audiobooks and your love of kitchen karaoke. When someone says to you, “Tina, what do you do?” how do you best answer that?
I say that we amplify the voices of leaders, entrepreneurs and trusted brands all over the world and our mediums are for doing that. Our podcasts and audiobooks are working with people to refine their vocal leadership so that they can make the impact that they want to make and reach the people that they need to reach. It’s all about having people get what they need so that they can grow. Audiobooks and podcasts are some of the lowest hanging fruit for people to change their lives.
Why are people reluctant to launch a podcast?
Podcasting is a lot of work. I usually recommend that if you are not familiar with podcasts as a medium and you haven’t been a guest on at least a couple, to get a lay of the land, then please don’t start a podcast from scratch. I’m specifically talking about podcasting for business. There are two kinds of podcasting, podcasting as a business and podcasting for your business. This wonderful, fabulous show that you have, Paul, is for your business. It’s part of your brand and your platform. It’s how you reach your audience. It’s wonderful to network with other professionals and it creates this home for you to welcome people and to have these conversations. Podcasting as a business is when somebody starts a show specifically to monetize it.
It’s usually sponsor-based and things like that. Those podcasts tend to be your true-crime podcast, your specialty podcasts like the Horse Radio Network or the show Trivial Warfare, which is pub trivia, but in a podcast format. Fantastic shows, those are high entertainment value and designed to be businesses in and of themselves. These are all things that you have to think about beforehand. Strategy planning and how much time you want to put into it. It’s super important before you decide to go ahead and launch a show.
You’ve seen an enormous change in the years you’ve been running Twin Flames. What do you see in the next 5 to 6 years? Where do you see podcasting of both types going?
Seth Godin has been saying that podcasting is the new blogging. I think that much like how blogging evolved over the years, we’re going to see a lot of people in the next few years flock to podcasting as a personal project. Not every podcast has to be monetized. It can be a passion project. It can be something you love to do. I never want to kill anybody’s dream of doing that because I understand the love of the microphone and connecting with people. I’m the first person to say that. At the same time, I think we’re going to see a lot more corporate influence in podcasting. This is not necessarily a bad thing because it does bring more dollars to the table and it brings more credibility to the medium. We've seen more large companies jump into podcasting, not even for external podcasting, but for internal podcasting. Using podcasting for internal communications, for making sure that in a workforce that maybe is working from home or on the road, you can keep culture strong and have communications be out there, celebrate each other’s wins, and all of that good stuff.
That’s another trend that we’re going to continue to see more and more of. I think we’re also going to see more businesses seeing the value in podcasting as an advertising medium and jumping in and doing long-form, narrative podcasting—the kind of podcast you’d hear on maybe National Public Radio in the US. It’s storytelling-based, but for business. There are companies like Pacific Content who are already doing this with companies like Facebook, Charles Schwab, and all that. That’s also going to continue as well. It’s an exciting and evolving world. I’m thrilled to be part of it.
Coming from a marketing background, you had to measure everything. It’s hard to measure things in marketing, but particularly in podcasts, it’s been difficult to measure things. How do you see the measurement supporting more dollars coming into the advertising spend?
Where we’re seeing the research coming out is in things like sticky branding. The listeners of podcasts reporting to survey companies like Edison Research who go out and do a lot of podcast research. They’re reporting that people are 80% more likely to purchase a brand that they’ve heard on a podcast that a host has endorsed—host-read ads, it’s really important that the ads are endorsed by the host or they’re tested by the host, there’s a relationship with the host. That’s the magic of advertising or sponsorship through podcasting.
I know this audio-only medium is intimate. Back when I was the lead interviewer on the podcast documentary, The Messengers, I interviewed 40 or 50 different podcasters. Almost none of them knew each other and the word intimacy kept coming up. Every single person mentioned it, that their communities had this bond and this intimacy over these topics. Maybe it was business or maybe it was about being part of a certain group. Maybe it was being part of a community that was part of fandom around a television show, and the things that would happen for people to support each other even though they had never met. There’s so much available here for us to explore. Storytelling is universal, and that’s important.
Going back to the numbers—this is why I think we’re going to see a lot more around internal podcasting. It’s easy to track the numbers around internal podcasting in terms of engagement. Engagement is a huge issue worldwide in the marketplace, for companies to increase engagement. We hear this over and over again in human resources and executive circles: “We have to increase engagement. We have to retain our talent. We need to increase efficacy,” all those things. There are specific measures and numbers that we can draw on that—it's little harder for external podcasting, but I’m hoping that we’ll see some breakthroughs in that area as well.
You hear numbers: There are 700,000 podcasts. There are lots of podcasts. I often talk to coaches and consultants and they say, “I don’t think the world needs another podcast.” What do you sayin when you hear that from potential clients?
I think that’s entirely possible. There’s a whole world of podcast guesting that is just as valuable in many cases as having your own podcast. I work a lot with executives and CEOs on their podcast messaging and the vocal leadership work that I do to have them be able to understand how to be interviewed on a podcast and what kind of content there is. The storytelling, and how you create a relationship with someone without seeing their face and interacting live—all of those things, that’s part of the world we’re in. It’s okay if you don’t want to start your own podcast. Maybe that’s not your entry point, but considering podcasting in all of its formats, internal podcasting, external podcasting, podcast guesting, or maybe your brand even advertises on podcasts as a sponsor, that’s another option too.
It’s a medium that’s not going away. How can we use it for our companies, businesses and our brands to utilize it the best way for you? I know that I’m engaging you to organize my podcast, which I’m a little nervous about, especially as having you as a guest. What are some of the key themes that you look for when organizing a podcast? If someone could think of this is what an expert like Tina’s looking at, so I can at least go and address some of those areas of my podcast. What would be those key things?
A couple of the basic things, and this is usually in the setup of your podcast: One, making sure you’re in the right categories. You’re able to get into three categories and subcategories in most cases and making sure that that’s aligned with what you’re doing. The second thing, is your show name—something that people are going to understand when they see it. Is that show name going to attract the people that you want as listeners immediately? This is where we run into that push-pull we sometimes have in our hearts about wanting to reach everyone. Because the truth is podcasts work better when they are niche, and when they reach a deep audience rather than a wide audience. That’s podcasting for your business. Podcasting as a business is a different animal—I keep having to make that distinction. When people see themselves immediately in your title and your content, they’re much more likely to become loyal listeners faster. That’s important.
The other thing is the length of your podcast. The question I get asked the most about podcasting is, “How long should my podcast be?” The true answer to that is however long you can be outrageously interesting for. Because in a solo show, truthfully, most people cannot be super interesting for longer than twenty minutes. It’s hard to do. It’s a lot of material to write because what is interesting to you in your head and what you’re teaching might be valuable content, but is it entertaining? Because entertainment is the most important thing about podcasting. It’s more important than education. It’s more important than inspiration. All of those things are secondary to entertainment. That’s where it comes into play. We say 20 minutes for a solo, 40 minutes for an interview is our general rule of thumb when you’re working with podcasting for business. Could it be longer? Yes, there are certain cases where that may happen, certain industries where people love in-depth content. Those are some of the first things that we start looking at.
For me, I find some of the big commercial podcasts, I find a little frustrating where of that 40 minutes let’s say or most of them are an hour. The ones that I listened to might be ten minutes are the same ads every time. I use the podcast app. I skip the start. I try to skip the end, which I know is just noise, but for you giving advice to people doing that or people like for myself, how long should ads be? Where should they be? Give us a little bit of advice on that.
This is where creativity comes into play. As I mentioned before, host-read ads are far more important, but where can you create storytelling around those ads? Do you have any particular sponsors that you have, Paul, or that you’ve heard of or maybe one you’d like to have?
I have got a sponsor.
What’s the name of your sponsor?
It’s Dubb.
They do some video production hosting. What’s the one thing you love about them?
The ability to break through all of the noise, especially on LinkedIn. A lot of people send texts, that’s all boring. Whereas when I send video on LinkedIn, it gets a lot better response.
On a host read ad, it might be something like, “I want to give a mention here to a tool I’ve been using lately. Have you heard of Dubb.com? There’s a lot of video production platforms out there, but what I love about Dubb is that I’m getting much higher engagement on LinkedIn. You know I love LinkedIn. I do a lot of networking on LinkedIn, so it’s important for me to have tools I can rely on. I’m encouraging you all to check out Dubb.com and see how you like it. I’d love your feedback. I’d like to know if you’re using it. Tag me in your posts on LinkedIn if you decide to use this tool and let’s compare notes. So check it out at Dubb.com.”
And that's why you have experts on your podcast! That was brilliant! You talked about LinkedIn. I know we’ve been working together for a little bit on LinkedIn. Tell us a little bit about the journey so far on LinkedIn for you.
I’ve got a large social media following around almost 200,000. At the same time, I have been frustrated with social media for a long time. It helps with our SEO. Certainly, it helps with our visibility. At the same time don’t tend to get a lot of business from our social media presence. That is why I reached out to you because we’re turning our attention to LinkedIn. Relationships are what is most important to me. We had a mutual colleague, Harry Duran, who’s also a podcast consultant. He introduced the two of us. In the months that we have been working with the BLG Collective, and you on LinkedIn, it’s fascinating—it’s been night and day. The best way I can put it is, the difference between going to a conference, when I go on to LinkedIn, I feel like I’m walking into a conference.
It’s a giant room full of people. Some of them I know, and some of them I don’t know, but it’s thousands of people in a room. Having the experience of working with this collective is like a little pod or a mastermind inside of LinkedIn. I’ve gotten to know some of these people and their work. We’re helping each other with our networks. I’m finding fantastic referrals, gaining referral partners, meeting people I would never have met before outside of my circles, which is valuable because it’s like walking into a whole new room or a whole new conference. I’m reaching people like crazy. The number of views and who’s commenting and the response that we’re getting is great. I’m super excited about continuing to build on it because I know it’s been a couple of months and I’m scratching the surface of what’s possible.
Before we go into the “Live” section, I do a live ad. What I’m going not to do is read out what I normally would give them, what Tina has given an absolute masterclass from the Dubb. If you do want to find out more about our community, it’s called Build Live Give Authority Machine. It helps you be seen as an expert and it’s important in these times. We’ve all received communication through LinkedIn. Did you read this before you sent it? What we do is help you build those relationships. There’s a great free live masterclass that you can watch. It’s around 30 minutes. As I said, with my voice, I’d speed it up so you can get through it in fifteen. All you have to do is go to BLGClick.com and you can watch that. Also, there are lots of tasks there on LinkedIn that can be done by somebody else. It doesn’t have to be by you. If you haven’t got a virtual assistant and you’d like to know more about that and how we use them to expedite both your authority and also new clients, go to BuildLiveGive.com/VA. The next section is the “Live” section, Tina. What are some daily habits that make you successful?
I do have a daily habit of meditation and exercise. That’s how I start my day. It took me a long time to get into the meditation part of things. I’ve been a pretty loyal exerciser—more on than off—for the last few years. The meditation is something I resisted, which is funny because both my parents are yoga teachers, but I finally surrendered to that. I’m glad I did because it’s important as well as the exercise. I also make sure I laugh at least once a day, whether it’s with my kids or watching something funny. A lot of times it’s with my husband being silly and making each other laugh. I need that connection. Those are probably my top three. I also have a routine of certain supplements I take to support my body, water intake, and things like that. Health and wellness are important to me.
You’re eating at least once a day if not more. If you’re doing that through karaoke in the kitchen, I’m sure you have more than one laugh a day. As I subtly said before, we’d love to see a little video even if it’s a clip that we can share with our audience. That would be great.
We’re going through COVID-19. You’ve talked about it briefly, but what are some of the learnings that you’ve gained through COVID that you will take on out the other end?
I have had this interesting experience because as much as I would have preferred this not happen, it feels as though I have been uniquely prepared to go through this experience. I am unbelievably grateful for that. I feel like I’ve been waiting twenty years to be in the right place at the right time. It’s strange to say that in light of all this, but I have been running a mobile business for more than a dozen years. My children are used to living a mobile lifestyle. They were homeschooled while we lived in Costa Rica some years ago, and they’re old enough to be independent. We haven’t had a tremendous amount of stress load put on us, and what that has allowed us to do is reach out and help more people.
We have gone back out to our former clients and made additional offers of help and support, tele-classes with their teams on vocal leadership, and so on. Not charging for it or anything like that, to help out through this particular process. I have had a tremendous amount of influx of people who are home—a lot of public speakers or companies that are like, “Now is the time. Let’s look at our online presence. Maybe we want to do a podcast. Maybe I want to do that audiobook.” It’s a privilege to be able to help people through that. I can’t complain about being in this situation because if this had to happen, then I couldn’t be in a better place to have to deal with it, to be completely honest. It’s a matter of energy management and making sure that I’m not overworking like crazy because we are trying to help as many people as we can, and working long hours to do so.
Robin, who’s your partner, he’s going to be reading this. What would you like to say to him about the support he’s given you through this journey?
Robin is not just my husband. It’s one of those situations where if people knew how good our relationship was, they wouldn’t believe me. It’s at that point. I know that sounds super Pollyanna and all that, but we’ve worked our butts off to have it be that way. Robin also works in the company with me on the operational side. He’s a 30-year software engineer and data architect. He brings dimensions to the company that to me seem like magic. I’m creative. I’m a visionary. I’m a people person. He’s like, “Why are we doing it this way? Why don’t we automate it? Why don’t we create the system?” It’s beautiful to have that ebb and flow. Support doesn’t even begin to scratch the surface of what he’s provided and who he is in all of this. We don’t get tired of each other. We feel like during the day, even though we’re in the same apartment, we miss each other. We can’t wait to get together at the end of the day because our days are full so that we can hang out after work, have dinner together and chill out.
The next section is the “Give” section. What’s a charity or a community that you’re passionate about, and why?
One of the charities I'm involved with is Project Forgive. It was started by Dr. Shawne Duperon, who’s doing some amazing work. She’s gotten the Dalai Lama involved and many people, Bishop Desmond Tutu, and many leaders from around the world. It’s this global mission to bring the spirit of human forgiveness into our communities and into ourselves as well. She teaches this work called “Accepting the Apology You’ll Never Receive.” If you can think of somebody, something that you would have loved an apology for, but you know you’ll never get it, having the experience of getting that is transformational on a number of levels. They are working with municipalities, with colleges, inside of prison systems, jail systems, and all that to bring this work of forgiveness and bring a lot more compassion to the systems that we live and deal with every day. I couldn’t say enough good things about the work they’re doing in the world.
We’re going to shift gears a little. What we’re going to do is go into the last section, which is the “Action” section. I’m going to ask you some questions and get some rapid-fire responses. The first one is what are your top three personal effectiveness tips?
Make sure you get enough sleep. Make sure you get enough water. And leave time every week to radically do nothing for at least 2 or 3 hours to give your brain a break and a reset.
I’ll do the first two. That last one’s going to be a challenge, but challenge accepted. What tech is essential to running your business?
We run a lot of our company off of G Suite and even the programming that Robin does hooks a lot into Google’s tools. We also love working with Asana for project management. I use Acuity for scheduling. Those are our big things. We stay fairly tech-light on things and run things lean. Those are some of my favorite tools inside the company.
You get the chance to listen to some amazing podcasts and also audiobooks, but what’s your best source of new ideas?
My best source of new ideas is that 2 or 3 hours of doing nothing that I mentioned. It’s that brain reset that allows the frontal lobe to remain juicy. Because if you think about it, you almost never get a good idea at your desk. They always come in the shower, when you’re driving, when you’re on a walk or something like that. That source of new ideas is in the quiet and in the rest, is when that happens.
Doing nothing, that means I can’t even physically move?
No, but it’s more of you’re not reading a book, you’re not listening to a podcast. You can do some manual things. Manual things are part of that but not hard work like swimming—maybe a walk, laying under a tree, that kind of stuff. It’s a challenge. I’m not all that good at it myself but when I do it, it works.
I must admit, for me to change out a corporate to my own business was spent picking all of us for four days with my dad. I don’t think that this experience would have got me to where I am now if I hadn’t done that. That was effectively doing nothing for four days.
The last question is the big one. I always leave it to the end, but what impact do you want to leave on the world?
Years ago when I was thinking about starting a business, I had a coach who said, “Tina, you have to create something that’s big—you can’t do it all by yourself. It might not be something you can finish in a lifetime.” That pissed me off. About a week later, I woke up from a dream where I had this vision of the world where people were all, worldwide, doing what they loved and bringing that sense of doing what they love home to their communities and their families. When they told their kids, “yes, you can do what you love and make a great living,” they were telling the truth from a place of integration and integrity—and that became a default setting for those kids for the next generation for them to pass on. We all have these beliefs. We talk about limiting beliefs, but what if that got turned on its head and our default setting was expansive beliefs? Having these ideas go out into the world through podcasting, audiobooks, and leadership is one of the ways that I want to contribute to creating the world I saw in that vision.
What a brilliant impact you want to leave. You can find out more about Tina at TwinFlamesStudios.com. Also, there’s a bit of a challenge that Tina wants us all to do. Other than do our own recording of kitchen karaoke and share it, she also wants you to search for her name—it’s Tina Dietz—and see how many slots on the first page of Google she covers because she’s telling me there are lots, so let’s put it to the test. Tina, I love working with you within our LinkedIn group. You can find out more about that at BLGClick.com but also, I’m looking forward to helping me spread experts like you spreading their word further with some of the help you’re doing with our show. It’s great having you on. I enjoyed it.
It’s my pleasure, Paul. Thank you.
Stay well, bye bye.
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I truly enjoyed this one. How good was the ad? It’s absolutely grand. You can find out more about Dubb at BuildLiveGive.com/dubb. What is your biggest takeaway from Tina? Please share on her social media. She would love it. If you believe someone you know would also benefit from the show, please share. You can learn the three secrets to building your authority on LinkedIn in a free, prerecorded master class at BLGClick.com. Please take action to build your business and lifestyle, and most importantly, stay well.
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, influence and vocal leadership expert who has been featured on media outlets including ABC, Inc.com, Huffington Post, and Forbes.
Tina’s podcast, The StartSomething Show, was named by INC magazine as one of the top 35 podcasts for entrepreneurs. Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, amplifies the influence of leaders, experts, and companies around the globe.
