With its dramatic development over the past two years, artificial intelligence (AI) is reshaping everything from writing and editing to marketing and intellectual property rights.
As authors and experts, you are the ones who will decide whether AI is a replacement to be feared or a tool to be mastered.
One thing is for sure though: AI is not a far-off fantasy.
That’s why I recently hosted some of the leading experts with experience in both authoring and publishing technologies: Thad Mcllroy, Elizabeth Ann West, and Jason Hamilton to discuss AI’s role in publishing and how you should navigate this important industry transformation.
The Current Landscape: Where Are We With AI in Publishing?
Is AI a disruptive innovation or a passing fad?
As Thad McIlroy, publishing analyst and author of The AI Revolution in Book Publishing, put it: “They're still asleep at the wheel, and the car is moving very rapidly down the freeway.”
While some major publishers remain skeptical, independent authors and small presses are already leveraging AI to increase productivity and expand creative possibilities.
For example, our live poll during the live panel showed an even split between attendees actively using AI and those still exploring.
The Big Five Ways AI Is Disrupting the Publishing Industry
Writing and Creative Process
Elizabeth Ann West, bestselling author and founder of Future Fiction Academy, emphasized that “AI's biggest threat is not to publishers—but to authors who ignore it.”
“Society needs authors using AI, not publishers,” she said. “With the right fine-tuning and prompting, AI can now generate publishable fiction that “makes you laugh, makes you cry.”
Jason Hamilton, author and founder of The Nerdy Novelist, encouraged creators to think bigger: “This isn’t about how to publish more books. Everybody can do that now. It’s about how we can do things that were never possible before.”
Editing and Productivity
If you need a burden lifted off your shoulders, AI is a useful tool to decrease stress and enhance workflow.
By using fine-tuning, you can draft entire scenes or chapters, suggest structural edits, or mimic your own writing style with surprising accuracy.
Marketing and Book Descriptions
If marketing seems like the bane of your existence, you’re not alone.
AI is changing that.
Hamilton shared his method for generating high-quality book descriptions: “Find a top indie in your genre, break down their blurb sentence-by-sentence with AI, then build a template. Feed in your synopsis, and you're already in the top 10%.”
Legal & Ethical Considerations
There’s still a lot of confusion and concern about copyright. However, it’s helpful to note that risks are more about misinformation than infringement.
West broke it down: “You can't copyright AI-generated words—but you can copyright the selection and arrangement.”
Think of it like fanfiction, where the author’s original additions are protected.
Thad McIlroy added, “The Copyright Office is misinterpreting the technology. What they're declaring is not realistic in this particular age of AI generation.”
Industry Dynamics and Market Saturation
AI is resulting in thousands of new books being published, but is the quality there yet?
AI is only as valuable as the person controlling it. Authors with a distinctive voice, a personal brand, and a strategy will prevail over the “AI slop” every time.
And if you’re a fan of niche genres, you’re in luck! If new technologies halve a book’s creation time, serving a smaller audience will be worth the hassle.
What Most Authors Miss
AI shouldn’t be treated like a magic button.
Don’t fall into that trap.
Instead, West emphasizes integrity and diligence: “You want a tool that gives you control, not one that does it for you.”
How to Start Using AI (the Smart Way)
Identify your biggest pain point (book descriptions, editing, plotting)
Use AI as a creative partner, not a replacement
Start with free resources like:
Future Fiction Academy
Nerdy Novelist YouTube channel
AI Writing for Authors Facebook Group
And above all: practice. The future of publishing is powered by AI.
Success won't come from blind adoption or rejection. It will come from authors who are willing to learn, adapt, and keep their creative integrity front and center.
I can’t wait to see what you create next!
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
While the publishing industry has undergone a period of rapid transformation, publicity as an industry may be changing even faster.
For authors and experts like you, publicity is still an essential tool to grow your audience, establish credibility, and, yes, sell books. But gone are the days of simply getting meaningful PR by sending out a press release and hoping for the best.
The most effective strategies now focus on reaching the right audience, not the largest one.
Your approach must focus on specific markets and opportunities, delivering the right message during those opportunities, and creating long-term relationships.
This is why I recently hosted some of the leading experts with experience in both the publishing and publicity industries: Mary O’Donohue, Jess Todtfeld, and Marissa Eigenbrood to share insights on what works, what doesn’t, and how to turn media attention into real results. Our own CMO, Ken Course, also chimed in with some timely insights.
What's Changed and What Hasn't
Traditional media has avoided a complete fall from grace but is nowhere near its gold standard status of years past.
The reason? With the rise of algorithms and increasingly short attention spans, niche media opportunities have become the most influential source of PR.
This means podcasts, targeted articles, and industry blogs are more likely to attract the right people who will support your work long after a fleeting TV appearance.
That’s not to say traditional media has no value, but effective publicity today requires a more diverse strategy. Developing multiple media touchpoints will get you to results faster.
Where Should You Focus Your PR Efforts?
Many authors and experts dream of the “home run” scenario.
While big media opportunities are impressive to have on your website or resume, they don’t always generate book sales.
Mass market, or “chasing the big crowd,” often misses your most engaged audience.
Jess Todtfeld notes that while high-profile appearances look impressive, “The right podcast audience is more likely to buy your book.”
Mary O’Donohue emphasizes the importance of clarity: “Know your goals—visibility and book sales are not always the same thing.”
Marissa Eigenbrood advises balancing different types of opportunities. “Brand-building media and audience-building media should work together,” she says.
Strategic, targeted publicity will award you the long-term results you need.
Do's and Don'ts of Media Interviews
What to Do:
Deliver value and don’t overdo the sales pitch. “Media interviews are a marketing asset someone else pays to create. If you treat it like an infomercial, you’ll lose the audience.” – Mary O’Donohue
Have a “real” conversation. “TV and radio hosts want a conversation, not a monologue. Be personable and responsive.” – Marissa Eigenbrood
Prepare strong answers to questions and reinforce them with a strong takeaway. “When an interviewer asks about your book, don’t say, ‘That’s in chapter five.’ Instead, give them a strong takeaway that makes them want to know more.” – Jess Todtfeld
Don’t forget your call to action, but make sure to give answers with substance. “Your appearances should always direct people to your website where they can sign up for something valuable or to take the next step with you.” – Ken Course
What to Avoid:
Being overly promotional. “Your job isn’t to sell; it’s to showcase your expertise and give value. The audience will buy your book if they trust and connect with you.” – Mary O’Donohue
Relying on “one big interview.” “Media exposure is about frequency. Keep showing up in different outlets to build recognition and credibility.” – Jess Todtfeld
Don’t forget to repurpose your media. “After an interview, share it everywhere. Leverage your appearance for months by repurposing clips, quotes, and key moments.” – Marissa Eigenbrood
Remember, the goal for every appearance is connection, not promotion.
Turning Your Publicity into Actual Book Sales
In the end, you want your media to convert into actual results.
This means going from attention to action.
Marissa Eigenbrood emphasizes, “Media exposure builds awareness, but consumers need multiple interactions before making a purchase.”
How to Make Your Publicity Convert:
Always have a way to capture leads. “Rather than sending readers to Amazon, direct them to your website where they can engage with your brand and access exclusive content.” – Ken Course
Have a variety of valuable offers. “Create incentives like downloadable guides, private Q&A sessions, or limited-time discounts to turn interest into sales.” – Jess Todtfeld
Leverage each appearance for weeks or months afterward. “One interview can be turned into multiple marketing assets—blog posts, social media snippets, email content. Maximize every piece of media exposure.” – Mary O’Donohue
When your calls to action are clear and easy, it makes a big difference.
For example, one of our recent authors saw their book ranking jump from #650,000 to #97 on Amazon overnight after an online article linked directly to their book page.
The Tools You Need for Successful PR
Check out these amazing resources our panel shared to streamline your outreach and stay organized:
ListenNotes (free/paid) – A searchable podcast database to find relevant shows.
MuckRack– A tool for researching journalists, tracking their coverage, and finding media contacts.
RecurPost – A scheduling tool for automating social media posts and maintaining a consistent online presence.
Cision (higher cost) – A comprehensive PR database for advanced media outreach and journalist connections.
PodMatch – A platform for podcast hosts and guests to connect and schedule interviews.
And of course, be sure to check out our Twin Flames StudiosAuthor Resource Directory to find credible, experienced PR help.
This includes contact information from our panelists!
The key to success is having a diverse and refined approach.
This results in better media coverage, bigger results, and ensures that every appearance works harder for your book, your brand, and your audience.
I can’t wait to hear how you put these tips into practice!
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
2025 is shaping up to be one of the biggest years of transformation for the publishing industry ever.
From groundbreaking AI tools to massive shifts in traditional publishing models, authors like you are navigating a wide range of challenges and exciting opportunities.
This is also why I recently hosted some of the leading experts in the publishing industry (and more of them are coming up here) Jane Friedman, Dale L. Roberts, and Andrea Fleck-Nisbet to explore the trends that you need to follow.
This is what you need to know to succeed with your project in the year ahead.
The Trends Changing the Publishing Industry Right Now
Hybrid Collaborations: The Best of Both Worlds
The publishing industry is changing their approach to partnering with authors in a big way.
The good news? A partnership gives authors like you access to wider retail markets while still retaining control over your digital rights.
Deals like this just weren’t possible in the past and traditional publishers weren’t as interested in them.
As a great example, check out Bloom Books, an imprint of Sourcebooks backed by Penguin Random House.
So what will this mean for you?
Hybrid collaborations will open doors for authors who have proven their market potential and want help scaling their success.
It’s a completely new type of marketplace.
AI’s (Obviously) Changing the Game
So, is it worth the hype yet?
Kind of…
But maybe not in the way you think.
AI is driving advances in translation, drafting, and audiobook production which makes publishing a lot more accessible. But there are a lot of warning flags popping up when it comes to copyright and author rights.
This is why tools like Created by Humans are helping ensure authors are compensated when their work is used to train AI models.
The legal and ethical battles over AI are still ongoing, which means it’s not going to be settled for a while yet.
Most importantly, while the technology is improving rapidly, it still lacks the nuanced touch of a human creator.
Should you be ignoring AI completely? Absolutely not. However, you should be carefully considering where and when to use it appropriately.
The Market Is Consolidating
In not so great news, many smaller distributors are starting to collapse.
This consolidation means narrowed options for indie authors and small presses while shifting the balance of power to larger distributors.
As a sad example, take a look at what recently happened with Diamond Comics.
What this means for you is that you likely won’t find as many options as you have in previous years.
The Opportunities You Need to Take Advantage of in 2025
It’s Easier than Ever to Engage Directly with Your Readers or Community
Your email list is still your most important asset and it’s more than a marketing tool—it’s your VIP lounge for building lasting connections.
Authors and publishers are building communities on social platforms that go beyond a single book sale.
This means you should be thinking of yourself as a community leader from the start.
Genre Interest is Shifting into Escapist Fiction and Reader Comfort (But Don’t Just Chase the Trends)
Readers are seeking comfort in uncertain times.
This means that genres like Cozy Fantasy are exploding in popularity. Think of it as your literary equivalent of a warm blanket and a cup of tea—hobbits optional. This trend of stories with low stakes and high vibes shows no signs of slowing.
But, while it’s tempting to jump on a bandwagon, authenticity really matters.
Writing what resonates with you and your audience is far more sustainable than chasing fleeting trends and will make it easier for you to maintain your community as discussed above.
You Have Access to More Data and Sales Opportunities Than Ever
Platforms like Benevity, LaterPress, and BookVault empower authors to sell directly to readers, retain higher royalties, and gather invaluable data about their audiences.
The great part: you get access to more data than you’ve ever had before!
Unlike traditional platforms like Amazon and Ingram, which only give you limited insights, direct sales platforms give you a clear view of your customers and buying trends.
Owning this data helps you:
Make smarter marketing decisions.
Build stronger connections with readers.
Optimize pricing and promotional strategies.
More and more, it's up to you to keep control of your list, sales, and community.
The tools are more accessible than ever.
Don’t Forget About Crowdfunding!
Crowdfunding may seem like it has come and gone, but that’s far from the case.
Kickstarter and other platforms are offering authors ways to fund your project while building excitement, community, and engagement the whole time.
For example, one author used Kickstarter to fund an entire national speaking tour while promoting their book—which changed the entire model of their launch.
Even When the Industry Changes, the Possibilities Are Still Huge
You’ll notice a theme in all of these points – expansion.
Yes, the model that has existed forever is going through a rude awakening. What most people think of when it comes to publishing doesn’t exist in the same way as before.
But, publishing in 2025 is still a world of possibilities.
And there’s still nothing quite like the impact of a book.
The future of publishing isn’t just about trends—it’s about how you as a leader, author, and creator tell stories that matter to your audience.
Want to see the entire hour with our expert panel? Watch it here!
I can’t wait to see what you create next.
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
As we wrap up our 2024 at Twin Flames Studios, our team reflected on their personal favorite nonfiction audiobooks we produced this year.
We’re incredibly lucky to work on so many inspiring audiobook projects and we’re proud of everything we’ve produced. With more than 100 audiobooks produced this year, it’s so hard to choose a favorite. All of the authors and voices we’ve shared are amazing!
But we wanted to share a bit more about the work and stories behind the scenes to give you a sneak peek of what stood out to our team.
This year, we asked our team to share their personal highlights: the audiobooks that made them think, laugh, or even cry—and a little something extra that brightened their 2024.
Along with each personal favorite, we also asked each team member to share a valuable tool that made a difference for them this year. Many of these will have value for you as well!
Favorite of: Caroline Schaeffer, Audiobook Production Specialist
Why it stood out: “Time travel, allegories, and engaging characters made this fictional journey not only entertaining but also a thought-provoking look at our modern society.”
This audiobook captured Caroline’s imagination with its layered storytelling and poignant commentary.
Caroline’s Favorite Gadget:Cold Brew Maker “I love my at-home cold brew maker! You can use it to make cold brew, iced tea, or fruit infusions, and there’s nothing quite as satisfying as having easy-access fresh cold brew in the fridge.”
Caroline’s pick is a nod to life’s little joys—and the fuel that keeps our production engine running.
Why it resonated: “This audiobook kept me fully engaged. The authors did an amazing job showing how we can get too wrapped up in our own emotions, wants, and needs—often ignoring those of the person we’re having a conversation with. The habits she discusses aren’t just for the workplace; they’re just as important in our personal lives.”
Christopher’s pick is a masterclass in empathy and connection—lessons we can all carry with us, whether we’re at work or around the dinner table.
Christopher’s Favorite Tool:Ozone 11 “I use Ozone to fine-tune audio. Sometimes it’s just a subtle frequency adjustment to change the tone, and other times it’s a much more drastic change. Ozone gives me the confidence to make those adjustments and get the exact sound I’m looking for.”
Christopher’s choice highlights the precision and artistry of audio production—a reminder that the details matter.
Why they made the list: “I completed two books with Chris Jennings this year—Conversations Made Easy and Client Retention Matrix—in less than 12 months. Both audiobooks included interviews as additional content, which made them even more engaging and informative.”
Stephen loved these projects for their innovative structure and added depth, showing just how much value a well-produced audiobook can bring!
Stephen’s Favorite Find:Fly Kitt “This is a vitamin supplement kit for when you travel. If you're going into a different time zone it will help reduce or eliminate jet lag. I used it when I went to Italy on an overnight flight and had no issues with being tired, so I could hit the ground running and enjoy my entire trip.”
Stephen’s practical pick is great for avid travelers!
Why it stood out: “We had such a great time recording this book. The author’s energy in every session made me enjoy both the job and the content that much more. We’d chat about what was happening in our lives, and I felt we built a genuine connection.”
Michael’s pick is a game-changing guide for entrepreneurs—and a reminder of the collaborative magic that happens behind the scenes.
Michael’s Favorite Tool:TASCAM Mixcast 4 Podcast Workstation “This equipment has been a game changer! It allowed me to remote-direct recordings for none other than Twin Flames Studios. What a great year it’s been!”
Michael’s pick proves that the right tools make all the difference—whether you’re recording a podcast or producing a bestseller.
Why it resonated: “It’s just a straightforward guide on how to be yourself in the workplace and how that can actually help, rather than hurt, your bottom line. It doesn’t hurt that, as a narrator, Mike sounded like Sir John Gielgud right out of the gate!”
Paul’s pick combines practical workplace advice with unforgettable narration—a perfect listen for professionals looking to thrive authentically.
Paul’s Favorite Tool:Ballpark DJ App “I found this app that allows you to record introductions for a youth or recreational team. I use it for my son’s 13-year-old baseball team, but you could also use it for an adult bowling league, a youth soccer team, or even to introduce your staff at a team meeting!”
Paul’s pick is as versatile as it is fun, bringing a personal touch to teamwork—whether on the field or in the office.
“I've been using Human Design to help me become a more effective leader and also to build my team more effectively. It's like if you took the best personality test and strengths assessment and put them on steroids. My very dear friend and colleague, Candy Barone, has a suite of free Human Design tools that she gives away, starting with a 20-page personal human design report for free, no strings attached. Her generosity in providing people with the tools to align with their best selves and their purpose is what I love about Candy, so much.”
“What will life be like when you have as many as 30 more podcasts and radio shows already booked right at the beginning of the year? Would that be a giant boost for you, your book or your current program? Here’s the great news… Our friend Jackie Lapin has a surefire way for you to get those 30 shows! She’s been doing it for 15 years for select clients. Some of her most recent Podcast/Radio Tours have actually generated 45, 50 and even 65 podcast invitations. This is my very favorite podcast guesting opportunity for authors!”
Looking Back, Moving Forward
From audiobooks that inspired deep reflection to tools that refined our craft, 2024 was a year filled with creativity, connection, and growth. Each staff pick is a small window into what makes our team tick—and a testament to the power of storytelling and innovation.
What inspired you this year?
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
Connecting With People Through the Power of Audiobooks
How are you getting your audience’s attention?
As you know, content is everywhere and the demands for attention are higher every day.
It’s easy for even the most compelling messages to get lost in the noise.
It’s critical to cut through the clutter and truly connect with your audience on a deeper, more personal level.
This is where the benefits of audiobooks now truly shine…
Audiobooks aren’t just a “format;” they’re an intimate experience that brings your words to life. When your voice tells your story, it’s not just heard—it’s felt. The cadence, the emotion, the subtle inflections—they all add layers of meaning that deepen the connection between you and your listener.
It’s an opportunity for deeper connection through content than nearly any other type of content that you will invest your time in creating.
Your message is more than just words on a page; it’s a reflection of your passion, your expertise, and your vision. When you translate that into an audiobook, you’re not just sharing information—you’re forging a connection.
So why aren’t more people producing audiobooks?
There are a few common issues and misconceptions we hear when talking with authors, publishers, editors and book coaches.
Misconception 1: Audiobooks Won’t Reach My Audience
Many authors underestimate the reach and influence of audiobooks. They think that their audience prefers physical books or eBooks and that producing an audiobook won’t add much value. But the truth is, audiobooks have steadily grown in popularity over the years.
52% of all U.S. adults have listened to an audiobook in their lifetime, and in 2023, revenue increased by 9% to $2 billion, according to the Audio Publishers Association.
Moreover, audiobooks can expand your reach to people with disabilities or those who prefer auditory learning. For many, reading can be a challenge due to visual impairments or dyslexia. Audiobooks offer an inclusive way for these individuals to enjoy your work without barriers.
By not offering an audiobook, you could be missing out on connecting with a whole segment of your audience who prefers consuming content in this format.
Misconception 2: Audiobooks Now Aren’t a Good Investment
Another common misconception is that producing audiobooks now requires a costly investment with little return. However, this couldn’t be further from the truth. Audiobooks can dramatically increase your audience, influence, and income. An audiobook has the potential to generate revenue indefinitely. Plus, with platforms like Audible, Google Play, Apple Books, and even Spotify, it’s easier than ever to distribute your audiobook to a global audience.
Authors are often surprised to learn that they don’t have to give away their royalties or go through a complicated process to see a return on their investment. The key is to work with an experienced team that understands how to navigate the audiobook market effectively.
Misconception 3: Audiobook Production is Complicated and Time-Consuming
Perhaps the most common reason authors hesitate to create an audiobook is the belief that it’s a complicated, time-consuming process. Many authors don’t know where to start or feel overwhelmed by the technical aspects of audiobook production. This is where working with a partner like Twin Flames Studios can make all the difference. We handle everything—from recording and editing to distribution—so you can focus on what you do best: telling your story. Our streamlined process ensures that your audiobook is produced to the highest quality standards while allowing you to maintain full creative control.
Let’s Create Audio Magic Together
The world of audiobooks is rich with opportunity, and there’s never been a better time to explore it.
Ready to take the next step?
I’m hosting an in-depth webinar on September 19th, 2024 at 12 PM Eastern that will show you how to boost your bottom line, expand your audience, and create an audiobook that will give you content for years to come. This is where you start.
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
All the publishing world was abuzz in 2023 with the inclusion of AI Audiobooks on the “Big 5” retail outlets Audible, Google Books, Apple Books, Barnes & Noble, and Kobo. Impassioned pleas for authenticity have clashed with diatribes on accessibility and cost across virtual platforms and conference rooms alike.
In 2024, the news cycle on this topic has simmered down considerably, leaving some important questions unanswered.
Are AI narrated Audiobooks selling?
Is it cost effective to use AI narration for Audiobooks?
Does the technology actually work?
Will I damage my reputation by using AI narration?
What about any innovations or “special cases” where AI narration can help with Audiobook production or sales?
Are AI Narrated Audiobooks Selling?
The short answer is NO.
It turns out that in 2023, resistance to AI narrated Audiobooks intensified. Audiobook listeners reported they weren’t likely to listen to AI generated audiobooks, even if the voice of the author was cloned.
Reviewing the presence of AI audiobooks in the marketplace, there are fewer than two thousand AI voiced audiobooks on the market, most with not great reviews, if any reviews at all.
For contrast, remember that 2700 books a DAY are published in the US alone.
Let’s call this initial reception to AI narrated Audiobooks “cool to lukewarm at best.” With all the buzz around AI in general throughout 2023, why didn’t AI Audiobooks perform well?
I’ll sum it up in one sentence.
NO ONE WANTS A ROBOT VOICE IN THEIR EARS FOR 4, 5, OR 8 HOURS.
This isn’t new. I interviewed a former long-time employee of Learning Ally, a respected and long-standing company devoted to providing accessible materials for children with learning differences, Michael Kinsey. Michael specializes in audio production and, in particular, Audiobooks. He’s also one of our Audiobook directors here at Twin Flames Studios.
“When text to speech came out, we wanted to use the technology to make more books available and accessible. The problem was, no one wanted to listen to a synthetic voice,” explained Kinsey.
“For example, we had a text to speech version of the book The Outsiders, which was taught in a lot of high school English classes for many years. Not very many students accessed it. But when we brought in a professional Audiobook Narrator to create a new version, suddenly the Audiobook version became one of our top titles. Students were listening to the Audiobook even when they didn’t have an assignment related to it.”
While the state of text to speech technology has come leaps and bounds in recent years, our ears and brains are discerning. When it comes to longer-form content like Audiobooks and podcasts, the numbers show that the technology isn’t good enough yet to replicate the nuance of the human voice.
Is it Cost Effective to Use AI for Audiobook Narration?
I keep hearing AI Audiobook narration being referred to as “cost effective.” That implies that you can get the job done for less and still reap the benefits. But if AI narrated Audiobooks aren’t selling well, we can’t call this a cost effective solution.
AI Audiobook Narration cost can range from free to about 5K per Audiobook. For the sake of comparison, our full Audiobook packages tend to range from 3-5K in either the case of author narration or professional narration.
This isn’t just about numbers; it’s about impact. Just think what those 250 people will accomplish by taking action in their lives, in their businesses, in their communities – because of what they learned as a result of your book.
If you go with one of the free options, you’re going to spend a considerable amount of time learning how to edit your Audiobook to get it to a finished product, and not even a finished product that would compare well with a human narrated audiobook.
Does the Technology for AI Audiobook Narration Really Work?
I do believe that at some point, AI audio will become pretty much indistinguishable from human voices. Since it’s not there yet though, here’s what we know is possible, based on research across Audiobook platforms and AI voice options.
1. AI audio narration voices are available in more than 25 different languages. HOWEVER, the translations are wildly inaccurate, particularly for long-form audio like an audiobook.
Want to know more about how inaccurate? Leave a comment on this post and if there’s enough interest, we’ll do a video demo!
Besides errors in translation from language to language, here are some other pitfalls of the current technology that it doesn’t handle well:
2. Dialects and diverse expressions
For example, one publisher of Judaic books noted to me that he had to abandon AI as a feasible option because AI can’t make the “Jewish” sounds denoted by Hebrew glottal [ʔ] (א) and [h] (ה), uvular [χ] (ח), and pharyngeal [ʕ] (ע).
3. Pronunciation issues and regionalisms
Getting AI to correctly pronounce names, or understand if you want the word “aunt” pronounced “ant” or “awnt,” or if you’re a Canadian author and want “process” pronounced “pro-cess” instead of “praw-cess,” is an exercise in frustration.
I could give you at least 50 examples of single words that have multiple pronunciations like the ones above.
4. Emotional nuance, pauses, and humor
We know from decades of sales data that what sells an Audiobook is the quality of the narration. The more a narrator, be they the author or a voice actor, feels like they’re right there with you and drawing you in, the better and more impactful the audiobook.
AI doesn’t know how to breathe, and lacks the natural cadence and pacing of human voices. This not only gives us that “uncanny valley” feeling when we listen, it also impacts the performance. AI doesn’t understand where nuanced pauses should go, or sometimes what words need to be emphasized. It definitely doesn’t understand jokes, irony, or sarcasm.
Imagine a romance novel where the narrator doesn’t understand longing, or desire…
Imagine a business book where you’re trying to learn something important, but the pauses aren’t in the right place, or the author meant something to be ironic and now you’re left feeling confused.
Our Senior Audiobook Director, Paul Stefano, has narrated many, MANY dozens of Audiobooks in his career, both fiction and nonfiction. Recently, he decided to license his voice to a reputable AI narration company, and they sent him a professionally edited audio sample of his AI voice clone. The voice clone was created from a recording of an audiobook that Paul owns the rights to, and this represents the best current technology in AI cloning that is easily accessible to the public.
Listen to both brief samples, and then imagine listening to each voice for 4, 6, 8, or 10 hours.
AI Narration Sample:
Natural Sample:
Will I Damage my Reputation by Using AI narration?
The Internet has a long memory. Back when The Gifts of Imperfection was originally published in 2010, Brene Brown’s publisher didn’t have her narrate the audiobook. In fact, the narrator wasn’t even close to Brene’s vocal style.
Things did not go well.
The book sold 3 million copies, but the audiobook did NOT.
One of the biggest requests that Brene had over the years was a version of that audiobook with her narrating, because Brene is highly known for her voice. She originally went viral via her TED Talk, she has podcasts, and her candor and combination of deep research and insight combined with a naturally enthusiastic “folksy” presence gives Brene a vocal thumbprint that is unmistakable.
What does this have to do with AI?
Well, if a highly produced Audiobook plus a professional, but ‘off the mark’ casted narrator hurt Brene’s Audiobook sales and ratings that much, just imagine what the reaction would be to an AI narrator.
When Brene released the 10th anniversary edition of The Gifts of Imperfection, she narrated a new version of the audiobook, and the ratings and reviews speak for themselves.
Not everyone is going to have Brene Brown’s level of notoriety and success, but she didn’t start out a multiple NYT bestseller. She was a college professor and researcher. If you are planning on being known for your voice as an expert, speaker, or industry leader, you need to cherish and cultivate your voice as a unique asset. If you’d like to get started with some exercises to help you develop your voice, here are some tools and resources for you.
What About Any Innovations or “Special Cases” Where AI Can Help with Audiobook Production or Marketing?
Yes, there are several places where AI is super helpful!
Overall, short-form content like social media is a good place for the current state of AI audio. We’re already used to hearing AI voices in social media on many viral reels, and this can save creators time and energy. Plus, if you’re not someone who loves being on camera, using an AI voiceover can work just fine for short content.
I personally love a good doggo voice over.
AI tools for promoting your Audiobook are becoming more abundant as well, which we love. I’m a fan of Vidyo.ai, which automatically edits longer video into clips for social media, blogs, etc.
PRO TIP: Convert your Audiobook files from .mp3 to .mp4 and get the AI to suggest short, interesting clips of your audiobook for promotional Videograms. You can also reach out to us to create these for you, they’re great for evergreen marketing campaigns, and cross promoting your articles, blogs posts, and newsletters with your audiobook.
And as a final thought, we’d love to see AI continue to evolve so that we could use it to make Audiobook edits. While an entire AI Audiobook narration is hard on our ears and brains, being able to replace some words using AI narration would be a great use of time, energy, and money for authors, narrators, and producers/publishers alike.
Audiobooks continue to sell at an accelerated rate, with double digit growth year on year for the last 12 years. They’re an enduring format, but what makes an Audiobook truly endure the test of time is the quality of narration. If you’re ready to create an Audiobook that you’re proud of for decades to come, contact us and let’s get your work into more ears and hearts.
Read and watch more Frequently Asked Questions about Audiobooks and benefit from our expertise, or Contact Us for more information and forthright advice about producing, distributing, and profiting from Audiobooks. Plus, download our Vocal Leadership Workout to develop and refine your the most influential tool you have — your voice!
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
Let’s get real for a second and talk about how to write a book for today's market and what it really means to do so.
The book publishing industry tells people to make dreams meet paper.
How? Write a book. They’ll tell you, “Publish that book! It’s your ticket to authority, uniqueness, and that indescribable je ne sais quoi that an expert needs to stand out.
But here’s the tea…
Peeling Back the Curtain on Publishing
Every single day, the U.S. greets 2,700 new titles. Yet, catching those 100,000+ sales is like finding a unicorn in a haystack.
The average self-published author?
They’re looking at 250 sales. But before you toss your manuscript out the window, hold up – because this is where it gets interesting.
The Mighty Power of 250
Imagine those 250 sales not as numbers, but as people – each one an individual connecting deeply with your message. This select audience could be the very people you’ve been aiming to reach, ready to champion your cause.
This isn’t just about numbers; it’s about impact. Just think what those 250 people will accomplish by taking action in their lives, in their businesses, in their communities – because of what they learned as a result of your book.
True Influence vs. Follower Count
In our digital era, it’s easy to get caught up in the follower frenzy. But here’s the kicker: real influence isn’t about how many, but about how much – the depth of connection, the conversations sparked, the actions taken. Authors like Brene Brown and Malcolm Gladwell didn’t just gather an audience; they built communities moved to action by their words.
Their books came first.
Nonfiction: A Catalyst for Change
Nonfiction books have this incredible capacity to not just share knowledge but to inspire action.
Think Rachel Carson’s Silent Spring or Betty Friedan’s The Feminine Mystique – these weren’t just books; they were movements that continue to shape our world today, many decades after they were published.
Your book could be the next catalyst for change, reaching those who are ready to listen and act.
How to WriteaBook in the Digital Age
While the digital world whirls with tweets and snaps, nonfiction books stand as islands of depth and reflection. They offer a pause, a chance to dive deep, and a platform for authors to share their most potent thoughts.
The advent of digital media has revolutionized the way knowledge is consumed, giving rise to questions about the relevance of traditional books in a fast-paced world. Yet, despite the proliferation of social media, short videos, and online courses, books remain unparalleled in their impact. Here's why:
Depth of Engagement: Books offer a depth of thought and analysis that short-form content simply cannot match. They allow authors to explore ideas comprehensively, fostering a deeper connection and understanding with their audience.
Perceived Authority: Publishing a book establishes an author's credibility in a way that transient digital content cannot. It is a tangible testament to an author's expertise and commitment to their field.
Longevity: Unlike social media posts or videos that quickly fade into the background, books have a lasting presence. They continue to be cited, referenced, and read years, if not decades, after their publication. Simply put, books endure.
Market Reach: Books open up opportunities to reach audiences beyond digital boundaries, including speaking engagements, workshops, and academic citations.
To Write, or Not to Write?
So, we circle back to the big question: Should you write and publish that book? If you’re looking to do more than just win a popularity contest – if you’re aiming to truly resonate and make a lasting impact – then yes, a thousand times yes.
This journey is about tapping into the unique power of books to connect, to inspire, and to mobilize. It’s about embracing the opportunity to share your voice, your vision, and your message with the world – and maybe, just maybe, change it for the better.
Writing and publishing a book isn’t just an item on a to-do list; it’s a path to creating ripples of change, fostering a community of engaged readers, and contributing something timeless to the global conversation. So, are you in? Because the world’s waiting for what you have to say.
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
Did Mercury retrograde specifically target the Audiobook industry in Q1 this year?
Between Spotify’s bewildering attempted rights grab and author Brandon Sanderson swinging his influence like Excalibur over Audible, the news around Audiobooks in 2024 is wild!
Here’s what’s been happening, and what authors need to know to make sure they are getting the most out of their Audiobook investment and rights.
IsMercury retrograde affecting the audiobook industry?
Spotify’s Thwarted Audiobook Rights Grab
Spotify positioned itself as a would-be competitor to Audible over the last 2 years, launching a monthly subscription service and retail audiobook sales on their platform. Spotify also purchased FindawayVoices, a long-time Audiobook distribution company that had been growing an Audiobook self-publishing and production platform for authors as a competitor to Audible’s ACX platform.
Currently, the only way for independent authors to have their Audiobook distributed on Spotify is to use Findaway.
On February 15, 2024, Spotify changed their terms of use on Findaway, requiring authors to grant broad rights to Spotify for translating, modifying, and creating derivative works from submitted audiobooks. This sparked immediate concerns among authors and publishing professionals who were worried this was encroaching on their Audiobook rights. The Authors Guild, among other industry watchdog groups, warned its members not to accept the new terms.
In fact, the response was so overwhelming that Spotify responded immediately. The new terms of use, released a day later on February 16, removed the overly broad rights and clarified that the rights granted were solely for the purpose of improving discoverability, anti-piracy, and anti-fraud measures – not for creating new content or AI voice training without permission.
Is it “safe” to publish your Audiobooks to Spotify at this point? I would say yes, given the updated Terms of Use. At the same time, we here at Twin Flames Studios will be keeping an eye on the situation and gathering industry news as always to make sure that authors are getting the best options for their Audiobooks.
Higher Audiobook Royalties Coming Soon from Audible
Brandon Sanderson, the esteemed science fiction and fantasy writer with more than 40 million book sales, is largely to thank for Audible’s impending new royalty structure, which is said to offer better terms for Audiobooks from independent authors.
This change comes after Sanderson's proactive discussions with Audible. Sanderson, who previously withheld the Audiobook versions of his Secret Projects series from Audible to encourage industry reform, will soon release them on the platform, recognizing Audible's steps towards improvement.
Sanderson noted that his desire for a more transparent and equitable system emerged from Audible’s ambiguous royalty and audio sales structure. As a result of Audible’s “credit” system, authors are often unsure of how their royalties are being accounted for.
Another point of contention Sanderson had with Audible was the percentage of sales authors receive in royalties. He explained that “While video game creators and musicians get 70–80% of a sale of their products… Audible is paying as low as 25%–with the high end being instead 40%.”
As a result of new negotiations with Audible through Sanderson’s team, minimum royalty rates for Audiobooks are increasing and the company is going to be more transparent about authors’ pay as it relates to “credits” spent by users. Additional changes include authors being paid royalties monthly instead of quarterly and the inclusion of additional documentation of how royalty amounts are calculated.
While the new structure doesn't fully meet all his expectations, it represents a significant step forward in the right direction for Audiobooks. My team and I at Twin Flames Studios will be the first in line to announce to our Audiobook clients that their royalties are increasing as soon as Audible makes these changes.
What most surprised you, or what do you still want to know? Let us know your thoughts below!
About Tina Dietz:
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert whose work and shows have been featured on media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal and Chicago Tribune, Inc.com, and Forbes. She’s been named one of the top podcasters for entrepreneurs by INC.com, and Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, re-imagines thought leadership through podcasting and audiobooks for experts, executives, and founders.
Audiobook sales are the most rapidly growing segment of the publishing industry. Registering double-digit revenue growth for the past few years, it is having a renaissance that can no longer be ignored. How can authors capitalize on this massive opportunity? Robin Colucci brings an expert on to the podcast to help us understand this booming industry. Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, corporate podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert. Her company, Twin Flames Studios, helps authors and experts amplify their voices through audiobooks, podcasting, and other means. Listen to her discussion with Robin and learn why you should be looking into audiobooks as the new golden goose in publishing.
The Renaissance of Audiobooks and How to Capitalize on It with Tina Dietz
Our topic is audiobooks. Audiobooks sales and consumption have been booming. This is the most rapidly growing segment of the publishing industry. It’s been on a growth surge for the last few years of double-digit revenue growth in the field of audiobooks. In 2019, we had another epic year of audiobook sales with 16% growth. The total sales in audiobooks were $1.2 billion. This is a phenomenal thing that’s occurring. I wanted to bring on an expert who could help us understand a little bit more about audiobooks, how authors should be thinking about audiobooks, and what we might be able to do as authors to capitalize on this massive opportunity. With that in mind, I have brought on Tina Dietz.
Tina is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, corporate podcast producer, and vocal leadership expert who has been featured in media outlets including ABC, Inc., The Huffington Post, and Forbes. Tina’s first podcast, the The Start Something Show was named by Inc. Magazine as one of the Top 35 Podcasts For Entrepreneurs. Tina’s company, Twin Flames Studios, amplifies the messages of experts globally to their target markets via audiobooks, podcasting, and leadership. Tina divides her time between the US and Costa Rica where she’s part of a leadership team building a conscious community called Vista Mundo. Without further ado, let’s welcome Tina.
It’s my absolute pleasure, Robin. Thanks for having me.
I’m excited to speak with you because even though I’ve been in the publishing world for many years and long before there was such a thing as audiobooks, it’s an area that I don’t know a whole lot about. I’m as excited for myself to learn as I am for our readers.
It’s an interesting world and industry. I’m happy to share.
Book marketing is an evergreen thing. A little bit every day is better than a big push once.
We all know what an audiobook is. A lot of us listen and have them. Audible is the most famous platform for an audiobook. Something I learned or at least got a taste of in our previous conversations is there are other platforms. I want to know a little bit about that because as I said, this is where you have “newbie Robin.”
Audible is the 500-pound gorilla in the room. They’d been around for a long time. Audiobooks have been around in one format or another. Since 1929 was the first audiobook, which was on an album. Audiobooks were on albums and then they were on tapes. A lot of us remember Books on Tape for years then moved to CDs and then, of course, it moved digitally. It was in the digital transition that happened that audiobooks have received a huge resurgence and a huge renaissance.
Prior to that, one of the first audiobooks I listened to as a young adult was Deepak Chopra’s Magical Mind, Magical Body. It was 12 or 16 tapes. I could not keep track of those damn tapes. I was always like, “What tape is next? I don’t remember which one I was listening to.” When digital audiobooks came about, it changed the game and much like the iPod Nano and the iPod in general changed music. Audiobooks changed in the same medium. Audiobooks, music, podcast, all of this audio content has had a tremendous rise in the last few years.
Audiobook Renaissance: Audiobooks are not as popular outside of the English-speaking world. However, they’re having a tremendous rise in countries like China and India.(Image via The Author's Corner)
It’s such a drastic thing that in my mind, there weren’t audiobooks available. Luckily, I haven’t been in the publishing industry since 1929, so that’s a relief. It’s interesting because you’re right. As soon as you started saying it, I’m like, “the tapes!” It was clumsy. It was difficult to manage. You had to keep track of where you were. You could lose one and lose a whole chunk of the book, and you had to be home. You had to be somewhere where you could also use the equipment.
If you didn’t have a car and Walkmans, things like that, that’s where things got more popular in that era. Prior to that, with albums, you couldn’t do that. I remember being a little kid sitting in front of my record player, having the book, and record from Disney. When Tinkerbell rings her little bell, it’s time to turn the page. I loved those when I was growing up. Those were fun. It was part of learning how to read. Audiobooks have this lovely, rich tradition, but because we live in such a different era now with the internet, digital, Bluetooth, and all the technology we have, as you said, the dots don’t necessarily get connected between the two.
Audible, in that pivot, does hold more than 60% of the market share in audiobooks worldwide. Audiobooks are not as popular in other places of the world outside of the English-speaking Western cultures. However, they’re having a tremendous rise in countries like China and India as the markets have opened up. I’m waiting with a bowl of popcorn. I’m excited to see what’s going to happen there. Going back to your original question, there are a lot more outlets than that.
There are more than 40 other audiobook outlets. This goes everywhere from your libraries. Most people get audiobooks out of their libraries. Those are usually using apps like OverDrive and Libby and sometimes Hoopla. Those are the three big ones for libraries. Those are the apps that they go through. There’s also Audiobooks.com, Downpour, Scribd. Blackstone has their own thing. You can purchase audiobooks through NOOK and other places as well. There’s a large distribution world for audiobooks out there.
I’m curious when a library purchases an audiobook, do they purchase a license or do they purchase a single audiobook like they put a book on the shelf?
The world of libraries does work differently than the retail world and it’s not an area that I have a tremendous depth of expertise. I’ll be transparent about that. To get on the radar of libraries is a lot more challenging. It depends on the types of titles that they’re looking for and their yearly budget mandate. Every community is different. As you can imagine, the number of libraries across the US alone is huge. It’s in the tens of thousands.
Getting into libraries can be an entire strategy in and of itself. The way to get on the radar of libraries is a little opaque because you can’t campaign libraries. You could but it’s a little different. The licensing works different for libraries. They have to purchase more than one license in order to be able to pass it around, so to speak. There are some people in the industry who specialize in selling books to libraries. The audiobook and the book process for purchasing to libraries is, from what I understand, quite similar.
Make a note to get me that contact. That could be also an interest.
It’s a great niche.
I did a little research for a client. They were writing a book that was more for school-age kids. There are over 46,000 school libraries, nevermind other libraries. In K-12, there were over 46,000 libraries in the US at that time. There are all these different platforms but Audible has the lion’s share. I’m curious when you’re working with a client on an audiobook, since we jumped in distribution, what is your goal when someone comes to you for help with an audiobook? Do you focus on Audible or do you try to get them any? How do you look at all these platforms that are available as part of your strategy?
We have to look at the overall goals of the author. We work with non-fiction authors. Fiction goals and non-fiction goals are very different worlds. Generally, the goals with the fiction author is to sell copies. That’s the only name of the game. Whereas a nonfiction author has their book. It’s being used in service of building their platform. Selling copies is important but if you’re selling bulk copies of your book, you’re more likely to sell them in bulk when you’re speaking or to be handed out as a promotional item as a loss leader, or various other things.
Getting speaking gigs, attracting clients, getting press, media attention, all of those things. The goals are different so the strategies are different. What binds the two together is, first of all, distribution platforms. Secondly, everybody does want to sell copies and wants visibility. The third thing is that book marketing, it’s you and I could agree, is an evergreen thing. A little bit every day is better than a big push once. That’s where authors get tired. We could have a whole conversation about that.
As you said, with the non-fiction authors especially, I always tell my clients, “Look at what activities you already are doing to grow your business or you know you should be doing and do those to promote your book because it will pay you off way bigger.” It keeps the book in the conversation that way too.
Going back to your question about what we focus on: We have to look at the goals and the overall strategy of the company or the individual first. What do you want your audiobook to do for you? What do you already have in place? Do you have a marketing team? Do you already have strategies for your book? How is this going to dovetail with all of that? Usually, in terms of distribution, what we end up recommending for the most part, particularly for a newer book. If you have a book coming out as a launch and the audiobook is coming out right around the same time as your book is launching or say within six months afterwards, then what ends up happening is they’ll be distributed exclusively through Audible, Amazon, and Apple Books for the first year, which takes advantage of a couple of things. One is a higher royalty rate. Royalty rates for exclusive distribution of 40% versus 25% for non-exclusive distribution. The other thing it takes advantage of is being able to focus on pushing your marketing, your customers, and your audience at one platform.
Amazon, Audible and Apple Books, that’s one?
Technically, that’s considered exclusive distribution because Audible and Amazon are the same company and Apple Books has an agreement with Audible for distribution. It’s an automatic also-run thing.
I’m going to guess Apple Books is the second biggest platform. Would that be accurate?
No, because Apple only holds 10% of the cell phone market. It seems like it’s everywhere but on a worldwide basis, Android is a much bigger player in terms of the cell phone markets. Apple is amazing in their marketing and they’re amazing at creating evangelists for their brand.
Audiobook Renaissance: The most important factor in someone deciding to purchase an audiobook is the quality of the narration. (Image via The Author's Corner)
This exclusive distribution, you said for the first year.
Yes. You then can evaluate after the first year and decide if you want to continue on or if you want to go with non-exclusive and then get the audiobook out to a bunch of more platforms.
What would be a good reason to be on? I’m wondering, if you’re getting 40% royalty and then it goes down to 25% royalty, does it ever add up like getting that extra market share offsets the decrease in the royalties?
It comes down again to marketing and the goals. If you don’t market, it’s not going to make any difference either way what it comes down to. It’s a marketing opportunity to change your distribution. Once you have your book on other platforms, you can make announcements about it like, “The audiobook is now available here. Did you know that this existed?” Much of marketing in our digital age, particularly on the 24-hour news cycle that is social media is coming up with interesting little, “Did you know,” pieces of information. It’s much like being nominated for a book award, getting a book award, having your book in a new place, or having a speaking opportunity. These are all little snippets of information to offer to your audience to stay top of mind. Additional distribution creates an additional opportunity for content to market your book.
What I’m getting out of this is that you’re adding these other distribution platforms, piecemeal, not all at once.
You submit it all at once but they tend to come in onesie-twosie in their approval process because you’re using a portal. The portals that we use and these are a self-serve portal. Not just for publishers but for people who want to self-publish as well. ACX.com is the common self-publishing backend for audiobooks for Audible. FindawayVoices.com can be also used for Audible but it will also help to get your book up to 40 additional platforms. Not everybody is going to take your book but a lot of them will.
What should I have asked you about the distribution that I didn’t?
That’s a lot of the broad strokes of that particular thing. The only thing about distribution that people need to know is that at least in the beginning, it’s something you want to stay on top of and go in. Read your monthly reports, get familiar with the notations that are made because that’s market research for you. What channels are working for you? What is not working for you? What are your best places to define readers? Certain distribution channels also, individually, if you look into them, may have more opportunities for you to promote your book in different ways.
Some paid opportunities usually come up. For example, Findaway and there’s this program called CHIRP, it sends out a daily email for audiobook deals. You can submit your audiobook to CHIRP once it’s been accepted through these other channels. Your book gets pushed out on a daily email to over 100,000 people. Now, you’re going to give them a deep discount on the audiobook as a result. If you’re talking about nonfiction and building an audience, building notoriety, all of that, that can be to your advantage.
I want to talk a little bit about audiobook production because one thing that we see is there seems to be two tracks. We either have the author themselves read the book or there’s a voiceover artist.
That is correct. Occasionally, that’s a hybrid of the two. That’s our third option.
Talk to me a little bit about what are the things like if an author comes to you and they’re like, “I’m not sure if I should read it myself or if I should hire a voiceover artist.” What are some of the things that an author should be thinking about when you’re looking for it?
One of the things the author should be thinking about, again, comes back to the purpose of the book. First of all, most authors who write non-fiction who are building a platform will come to me and say, “I have to narrate my book. Nobody can do it like me.” That is the first assumption that we question because that may be true. However, the most important factor in someone deciding to purchase an audiobook is the quality of the narration. Even if the author can read the book out loud in a way that they feel characterizes the book correctly, whether that translates or not to a listener receiving it the way it’s intended is an entirely different matter. They may feel like, “This is how I need it to be read,” but their listener may be going, “That is not what you’re portraying.” That is one of the things we have to take a look at and evaluate.
A lot of the folks we work with, our speakers narrating an audiobook is different than public speaking. It’s a tool. It’s a different animal. When you’re up on a stage, public speaking, you’re speaking one to many whereas on a podcast or a narration, you’re speaking one-to-one. You can’t get out there and be like, “Ladies and gentlemen, we’re going to be doing all of this and talk about audiobooks.” It blows your face off. You also can’t be boring but you have to slow down with an audiobook because audiobooks are at a slower pace than most other kinds of speaking. There’s a balance there. The breathing is different.
Recording an audiobook takes time and that’s if you hire a professional. If you want to go DIY, double that time and add a bottle of vodka.
Even the duration of time that you have to spend recording an audiobook—it’s not just a matter of reading the book. It’s reading the book in such a way that it sounds like you’re not reading it. There are all of these factors that go into it. In the early days of developing the company and the services and all of that, we did experiment with a number of different ways of working with authors who wanted to narrate their own books because it is an important thing. About 1/3 of our authors self-narrate and about 2/3 work with a professional narrator. That’s the way it shakes out. Some because they don’t have a great voice for narration.
They’re great for a keynote, but if you had to listen to them for 6 or 7 hours, no. Again, a different animal. There may be some physical issues. One of my favorite authors, brilliant book, brilliant man, and a rare form of head-neck cancer. He couldn’t narrate his entire book. There was no way. We did what I like to call the Tony Robbins Sandwich with his book. Tony Robbins narrates the first chapters and the last chapter of his book and has a professional narrator do the middle. That’s what we did with that particular client. It worked out well. Those are some of the factors.
Audiobook Renaissance: There need to be more opportunities for a diversity of narrators. One of the reasons people didn’t listen to audiobooks more is because they were boring.(Image via The Author's Corner)
There’s something in here because when you were talking about a speaker on stage being one-to-many, an audiobook is a one-on-one. I want to point out an idea that goes along with that. It’s something that I speak about fairly regularly is this idea of how a book is the best way when you’re thinking about a marketing avenue to create intimacy to your prospective client or with your reader when we’re talking non-fiction. It’s often your prospective clients or somebody who’s going to be influenced by you in some way. What you’re saying about audiobooks and even the tone of the voice, the pace of the speech, volume, and everything else, I never thought of it before but you’re right. It is a one-on-one conversation, just like the writing is but it’s important to get that across. It’s even different if you’re standing at a book signing in front of the room and reading an excerpt.
You have more bodies there and different energy.
That is one-to-many, but an audiobook is a one-on-one conversation. One of the things is vocal quality. Even the amount of time the author is willing or able to—
The time is a big factor. I’ll give you simple math, 10,000 words of a book are about one hour of audio. You’ve got 40,000-word book, you’ve got about a four-hour audiobook. That four hours of the audiobook is going to take about 10 to 12 hours of recording time. This is working with a professional organization like us. This is not DIY. For DIY, double that and add a bottle of vodka. It’s not just me saying this and do a shot for every hour of audiobook you do, it’s a drinking game. Split up into 2 to 3-hour chunks because that’s about as far as you can go with our vocal fatigue and energy issues and all of that.
What we do to work with the author and take the technology out of their hands and also to give them the objective feedback and a person to play off of, is we do the full direction of our audiobooks, but we do it remotely. We have software we’re able to remote in to wherever the author is anywhere in the world, help them make sure that their sound is tuned correctly, we’ll suggest a microphone, make sure they’re in the right place in their home or office to record. We then fully direct and record the audiobook for them to the entire process. That creates a wonderful product. It also takes a lot of the stress and pressure off of the author. All they have to do is focus on delivering their message and being natural about it and that helps a lot.
You’re able to give them feedback.
Yes, so it makes it a lot easier to catch issues. A lot of our authors have charts, graphs, and exercises in their books. There are industry standards on how to narrate those. We’re able to live coach people through all that process as well.
Let’s talk a little bit about the other side of hiring vocal artists to record your audiobook. What are some of the things that you advise authors to consider when they’re trying to make that decision? Let’s say they’ve decided, “I’d like to use the voiceover artists.” What are some of the things that they should be thinking about as they’re deciding? What’s that going to look like?
I have done professional narration. My background's as a therapist. As an entrepreneur of multiple businesses, did business coaching for years, but the voice acting was a paid hobby for me because I love a stage and a microphone. The masterclasses I took on audiobook narration had me have this epiphany about all my colleagues and clients who are doing bestseller campaigns, why aren’t they doing audiobooks? That was the rabbit hole I went down. That’s how I got there.
Between the podcasting and the audiobooks, microphones are a big part of my day one way or another. Narration and voiceover work in its industry. It has its own language and standards. Coming into that world as an author or as a business owner, there are some things you need to know about that industry. When we send out auditions, there are key pieces of information you need to provide to an author in terms of, what are you paying? What section of the book do you choose for an audition and how long it is? Where do you choose from the book?
Other key pieces of information that the narrator is going to need. If you want somebody to emulate your energy and have similar qualities to your voice being able to articulate, what are those qualities that are most important? What are the key pieces that somebody needs to know if the book is going to, first of all, resonate with them and what they need to deliver to you in terms of an audition? A lot of mistakes that authors make doing this on their own are putting an audition piece out that’s way too long and then being offended when somebody only sends back one minute of an audition. Auditions need to be short. Another thing that happens a lot is getting into the production of the audiobook and not having been clear upfront about the number of characters or the type of characters, even in non-fiction.
A lot of the pronunciation issues can come in regionalisms. We had an issue a while back. We keep a running list of these and this one we hadn’t run into yet. We had 38 replacements. You can’t go back when in audio like you can in text and do a find and replace. This narrator had to go back and we worked with the other because normally, we wouldn’t even allow that change at the end. That’s something that needs to be discussed upfront. Fortunately, the narrator was game and it all worked out but she would have had to replace entire paragraphs or entire sentences depending on the situation in the book. These are the things we get ahead of and get on top of. Occasionally, things happen as I mentioned. We get ahead of it 99% more than working through it on your own. Those are a few things.
What is the question that an author asks themselves even going into that? How do they know to tell somebody that they want that? It made me think of The Chicago Manual of Style which we both know is the publishing industry bible for punctuation and everything. It’s a perfect book except you have to know there might be a mistake to look for the correct way. How do you help authors figure out what to ask for in even a situation like that?
We have a whole onboarding process where we go through things like that. We have protocols, guidelines, and all of these things that we walk people and authors through to help prevent things like this. Everything from names to medical terminology and other types of regionalisms even down to looking at, “Are there any characters in your book, even if it’s nonfiction, who are they? What do they sound like?” One of my favorite books we ever did so far is called Tiger Bravo’s War. It is a ten-hour audiobook about the Vietnam War that I would put up against Ken Burns any day of the week.
Our narrator who works with us in the company now on our podcasting divisions. He’s a wonderful guy named David White. He did an incredible job of nuancing about 15 or 20 different soldiers’ voices inside of this documentary-style memoir. Getting those characters out front, getting a sense of who they are, and having the narrator demonstrate that before you get too deep into the production, that’s important.
I want to bring up something because you cleared a memory for me of an audiobook that I was listening to and I was enjoying. I believe the author Red Moskoff. They did a character and they brought in a different voice. By the way, this was traditionally published—New York Times. Not only was it a terrible Middle Eastern accent, it was so bad that it sounded racist to me. It’s offensively bad.
They went full Apu from the Simpsons.
That’s a perfect analogy. I was going to say it was like a Breakfast at Tiffany’s nightmare. I still enjoyed the book but every time that would happen, unfortunately, it was more than once in the manuscript. I would cringe and it nearly ruined the experience for me. What about characterization, especially when it’s clearly across cultural narrations? This seems to me to be a real potential minefield. If you could you say a little bit about that.
There is always something to get better at.
It can be. We produced a book that was author narrated and it was an emotional book. As I’m talking with potential clients and scanning through their books, a lot of them are highly emotional. I was crying in the first two pages of this guy’s book. He was writing it and he was an angry, abusive man. It was about his healing journey and what he wanted men to know. He had traveled to many countries as a professional Rugby player. He had voices of these people from different countries and cultures. He had a lot of facility in doing this.
He was able to slip into their skins—which most authors don’t have that ability to do. One of the things that the director did is he went and listened to other authentic accents to see how far off or how far on the author was and to make sure it didn’t come off as mocking or disrespectful in any way. There are ways to handle it in the direction process. Professional narrators are sensitive to this because they want things to be represented accurately. That comes down to the audition process and vetting people.
I didn’t feel like we needed the accent in that book I’m telling you.
A lot of times it’s not necessary or there’s a shade. You don’t have to hit it hard.
Why is this even happening?
It happens a lot with male narrators doing female voices as well. Some are brilliant at it. Some of them will characterize female voices as whiny, shrewish, or childish. That’s an issue in the industry that gets brought up regularly and on both sides. Women doing male voices, men doing women’s voices because it’s one narrator. Full cast recordings are still quite rare in the industry because of the cost of production. Some of them are great, like The Graveyard Book by Neil Gaiman, but particularly in non-fiction full-cast recording.
I’m glad we got a chance to talk about that. It left quite an impression on me.
If we have culturally diverse authors and one of our authors is from China. We opted not to have him do the narration. His articulation isn’t quite up to speed. It might be hard for the listener. He’s a brilliant speaker from the stage—he’s fantastic. But 8 to 10 hours on an audiobook will be harder. One of our biggest challenges has been finding somebody who is Chinese-American or Chinese immigrated to the US, a professional narrator who can do this voice authentically.
Have a hint of the authentic accent without being thick.
It needs to be real.
That’s another aspect of this. If the author is an immigrant or something in the US.
We have several books in the pipeline that we know our narrator searches expanded because there need to be more opportunities for a diversity of narrators. For years, it was, “This is Audible. I’m an Audible guy.” That’s one of the reasons people didn’t listen to audiobooks because they were boring.
“I’m a suburban white man Audible.”
“Can you see my blue suit just from the tone of my voice? I bet you can.”
“On weekends, I wear khakis.”
“I play golf.” I’m a professional instigator, I should warn you.
What I wanted to say is this sounds like a heck of an opportunity. Let’s talk a little bit about investment-wise. What’s the difference when we hire an artist to record our audiobook for us versus doing it ourselves?
There are a couple of levels. We try to keep the cost of author narration and the cost of professional narration very similar. The business model we’ve created has allowed for that because counterintuitively to a lot of people, it used to be in our company that author narration was way more expensive. I run into that all the time but think about it. We had to train the author on a whole new skillset. We had to research studios. We had to pay studio time, which is hourly, and studio time, depending on where you are in the world, is anywhere from $50 to $250 an hour. The editing was a lot more intensive because we weren’t doing what’s called Punch and Roll recording. We weren’t doing live direction. Studios will give you a sound engineer who’ll tell you if you’re screwing up but they just record the whole session. We stop, back up, and record again to get rid of a lot of those errors.
The comfort level of the author was tense because even with training them ahead of time, it was crazy. All of those factors make for a much more expensive prospect. We’ve got things down and we have a negotiated rate with our narrators that we’ve got a sweet spot. However, we do also have a premium level for narrators. These are folks who are in the Actor’s Union, SAG-AFTRA. The minimum required hourly rate to work with those folks is $225 an hour. That’s what’s called a per finished hour rate. That can include multiple things. That’s not studio hours. I go back to that 40,000-word book is four hours long. It would be $225 for four hours. That’s the math we’re talking about here. We’re not talking about 15, 20 hours in a studio at $225 an hour.
Audiobook Renaissance: It’s always better to experiment, beta test, and interest focus group things out before making a big launch. (Image via The Author's Corner)
That’s a lot more reasonable than I would have been imagining.
The average audiobook that we produce is somewhere in the $2,800 to $5,000 range.
I’ve heard of people charging 2 to 4 times.
It can get high depending on how much margin they’re adding. If you’re working out of New York or LA, your price automatically goes up because the cost of production is much higher in those cities.
If you’re hiring the talent or as you said, you were able to do it remotely, that’s not as expensive.
All the companies I’ve ever owned, except for my first one, was in completely remote. For years, we’ve been 100%t remote and my team is across North America and Europe.
A lot of businesses like mine are similar. We were already working remotely. The pandemic added my social life to the remote category.
I lost all my coffee offices for a while. I know that talk about first world problems, but nonetheless.
This has been informative. We talked about production, distribution, costs, and talent. The thing that’s occurring to me now is, you don’t have to reveal any names or anything. Do you have any stories of audiobooks either gone extremely well or horribly wrong? I always love a good story.
One of the reasons we changed the way we were doing things and I looked for solutions around author narration is because of both the amount of time that it took to work with authors that way and then having to go to the studio and the cost involved. Like with many things in business, a lot of what has to be handled upfront is expectation management. For people who don’t understand what it takes to edit audio and rerecord audio versus text, we call it a repeated education process and 90% of people get it. We occasionally do end up with someone who resists the training and coaching, and then after recording wants to go back and rerecord the whole thing because “now they have a handle on it” and think that’s included.
That is not the way that works. You can’t go back and do another ten hours of recording because you feel like it. You haven’t taken the coaching and been willing to do the work that needs to be done. Similarly, managing expectations on the professionally narrated side of things, it’s important upfront to get all of the expectations, voices, cadence, timing, pacing, and all these things are done. We do all that in what’s called the first fifteen of the book. We take about the first 15, 20 minutes, produce it, and make sure that it’s what the author wants before we produce the rest of the book.
We have an audiobook that created a tremendous amount of havoc in the author’s life because they realized in listening back to their own work, that they hated their work and wanted to shutter their company. It was intense. In hearing a third party deliver their work back to them, they had a breakdown. I’m a therapist by training but they were also in a different country, difficult to reach, and a long time difference. It ended up being an abandoned project with them not paying their bill because they decided to not move forward with their company. That resulted in some policy changes on our side of things.
Once you’ve been in business for a while, there are always a few items in the contract that were created in response to a specific situation.
That’s why contracts end up being so long.
They’re like, “We can’t let that happen again. Let’s set this.”
Making people’s initials in certain paragraphs is something we do because it’s easy like the terms and condition page to scroll to the bottom and check, “I have read it.” It is important to read. I don’t read all the terms and conditions either, but in contracts, I definitely read every word because there could be some questions there.
I’m thinking about that. They should have paid you but it could have been a great thing that happened for them.
That’s the thing and I don’t disagree. It was a case of somebody who was extremely well-meaning, had gone out, and they were putting themselves forward as an expert in an area that they had no experience in. It was all academic knowledge. It was all from synthesizing reading and going to workshops. They had never had a single client ever. They, unfortunately, spent over six figures in trying to launch this company. This is a lesson in entrepreneurship. I know there’s somebody out there who needs to know this. I’ve never told this story or alluded to this story anywhere in the media before. I built many businesses and companies my time and helped many other people do the same. It’s much better to experiment, beta test, and interest focus group things out before you do a big website, a book launch, or anything like that.
I want to add to that because this has shown up many times in my business that somebody will come to me in that situation. They’re like, “I want help writing a book.” I’ll be like, “Cool but I’m not going to be the one helping you.” You have no business writing a book about your expertise until you’ve developed some expertise. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people out there who will tell people, “You need a book so you can have a business.” It isn’t true. It’s such a dramatic illustration of a big problem but this is investing over six figures to launch a brand with nothing behind it. By the time he came to you, most of that money was spent.
It doesn’t matter what religion you are. When it comes to sales, you have to become a Buddhist at that moment.
This is an aftereffect of it.
I will let people write a booklet. Quick turnaround, test, and we do help people with that. That’s why I came up with that idea, by the way, was because I turned away thousands of people over the last years who came to me wanting to write a book in exactly that situation and said, “Go become an expert and then come back.”
Come back when you have some chops in what you’re doing. That happens more on the podcasting side of our company. I will pivot people from, “I need to start a podcast.” “No, you don’t need to start a podcast. You need to build some clientele, sell some stuff, and be in business.” I’ll pivot them from having their own podcast to podcast guesting. That’s a great way both to network, to generate content, to build authority, all of those things that you want to do without the massive commitment that it is to have a quality podcast.
I know we’re a little off-topic, but I agree with you. There are people reading this who need to know this. When people start a podcast, what they need to do is get clients. When they decide to write a book, what they need to do is get clients or do an audiobook. The problem is if it feels productive. They can get up in the morning and say, “I’m growing my business,” “I’m recording a podcast,” or “I’m working on my book.” What they’re not seeing is what they’re avoiding. If people don’t have clients yet and everything’s theoretical, it’s because they don’t feel comfortable with doing sales.
A lot of what shows up looking like productivity is an expensive, very long avoidance strategy that could eat up somebody’s entire savings and set them back in terms of their ability to generate momentum in their business because they’re trying to avoid sales subconsciously. What’s they’re saying is, “This is what I do. This is how much it costs, Mastercard, American Express, or Visa.” That’s what innate and they can tell themselves they’re being productive. That’s why it’s so destructive when people tell people that. It’s a double whammy. When they figure it out, their resources are drained.
I bootstrapped my businesses in the beginning for years working other jobs, whatnot is exploring, and all of that. Sometimes you get sold the dream. I grew up in a situation, my parents owned a business, and I was surrounded by sales. Even I wasn’t comfortable with sales until I was in my late 20s, early 30s, it’s always something to learn. There’s always something to master or get better at. It never has anything to do with making the sale, it has everything to do with your internal conversation, your personal growth, and your ability to create relationships. The sales has nothing to do with sales.
We can do a whole episode on sales. I look at it that the sales conversation is a quest for clarity and to help the person that I’m on the phone will come to a place of clarity. If the clarity dictates that we work together, we work together. If the clarity dictates that we don’t work together, we don’t work together. That takes all of the pressure off everybody. I don’t feel pressure to make the sale and they don’t feel pressured too or people like they’re being sold because that’s not what the conversation is about.
This was a mentor of mine that created a lot of clarity for me around sales. Robin, how do you feel about cookies?
I love cookies.
If I were to bake a plate of cookies, I would say, “Robin, would you like a cookie?” Assuming we were together and not social distancing, you would say yes, right?
Yes.
If I were in a room, I walked around, and I offered 100 people a cookie, some people are going to say yes and some people are going to say no. The people who say no, is there anything wrong with my cookie?
Nothing is wrong with your cookie.
The people who say yes, is there anything magical about that cookie special or does it mean anything?
No.
There are all reasons they could have said no. They could be diabetic, not like that particular cookie, allergic to one of the ingredients, not hungry, or on a diet. The cookie has nothing to do with me. It has nothing to do with my worth or even with my ability as a baker. People say yes or no. Ultimately, you go out into the world and you think about “selling something.” You’re offering them your cookie, and there’s nothing wrong with your cookie.
That’s a great analogy. That was the hardest thing for me to get over because I went from a place of being afraid of sales to I’m almost addicted to sales. I love selling. It’s fun. The big thing that I had to get over was taking it personally either I was lacking or what’s wrong with me. That’s how I did. I was having a lot of conversations in a short period of time to the point where I didn’t care.
That happens a lot with people learning how to like their own voices. They have to listen to themselves over and over again. I say all the time, “It doesn’t matter what religion you are. When it comes to sales, you have to become a Buddhist at that moment. You just have to practice non-attachment.” Temporary conversion. You can convert back afterward.
You can pick up all your baggage. Tina, this has been wonderful and informative. Thank you for sharing your insight, wisdom, and great stories with us.
Thanks, Robin. This has been awesome. I appreciate it.
Tina Dietz is an award-winning and internationally acclaimed speaker, audiobook publisher, podcast producer, and influence marketing expert who has been featured on media outlets including ABC, Inc.com, Huffington Post and Forbes. Tina’s first podcast, The StartSomething Show, was named by INC magazine as one of the top 35 podcasts for entrepreneurs.
In 2016, Tina was the recipient of the Evolutionary Business Council MORE award and in 2017 she received the award for Outstanding Audio Company from The Winner’s Circle. She is also a member of the EBC leadership body and a founding member of the Forbes Coaches Council. Tina was also the lead interviewer in the podcasting documentary “The Messengers” and featured in the film.Tina splits her time between the US and Costa Rica where she’s part of the leadership team building a community of conscious leaders called Vista Mundo.
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Tune in to episode 111 of The Creative Impostor podcast, hosted by Andrea Klunder. We will show you how to amplify your message(Podcast on The Creative Impostor, August 9, 2020)
Episode 111. “In this phase of growth, it feels weird. It feels nebulous. It feels like this molting bird… Sometimes it takes as long as it takes, you know, it's not the enlightenment Olympics.” ~Tina Dietz
This episode is for the birds. Or rather, about birds. More accurately, how much creative humans have in common with molting parrots.
Hang with me; this episode isn't wall-to-wall ornithology talk. I recorded my conversation with Vocal Leadership Expert and Podcast Host Tina Dietz way back in the before-times. Still, her message about self-acceptance and faith in our creative evolution rings doubly true at a time when putting our trust in anything is a struggle.
She just happens to equate this transition with shedding feathers.
As founder and CEO of Twin Flames Studios, Tina molds (not molts) experts into influencers, teaching clients how to amplify their message. Whether it's through their own podcasts, as guests of other shows, or as in-demand speakers, Tina's vocal leadership expertise goes beyond the simple correction of speech mechanics.
Transitions rarely come without challenges. There's the macro level, global shifts taking place right now, and then there are the awkward personal doubts and missteps.
You're not wrong for feeling vulnerable. Massive life changes force us to question our personal and professional identities.